Behringer - US600 Ultra Shifter / Harmonist

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Post by CHEEZOR »

Hey, has anyone checked out one of these things? I just tried one out today, and I was really impressed. I thought it would be cool to start a thread about modding this thing since it is really cheap compared to some of the other pitch shifters out there. There are a lot of features on this thing for the price. Does anybody know if it is a copy of another product or if they actually made their own pedal? Any ideas/thoughts?

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Post by ansil »

nearly all the Behringer pedals are all boss inspired. a few that have been pulled apart seem to be really close to the original design all be it done crappier. this isn't to say all of them are only the few that i have looked at. however after looking at the old boss feed backer pedal and deciding to clone it without some of the jfet switching crap i re engineered it only to find that it would be easier to build my own distortion circuit inside on a piece of perf and bypass all their stuff. then i found the Behringer and decided that it sounded pretty darn good might just try that one instead. i mean for the money putting it in a cheap Hammond box and upgrading it.

i recently upgraded a CHORUS SPACE-D CD400 for my buddy and while i was doing his i had what i thought to be a stroke of genius instead of worrying about making it true bypass by switching the fet on like i did in my boss pedals i just removed the jacks on the board utilized switchcraft jacks as i always do i added a mini switch to turn it on and off manually.sometimes you can do the boss switch so now i just manually turn them all on at beginning of a gig and then use the jack to switch the signal if you can do it without adding anything using the components already there it makes me happy lol

mod ideas are since most of them have a tracking input that needs to be clean input try adding a buffer stage there or maybe a ten x gain stage to help the tracking.

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Post by JiM »

I suppose that most pitch-shifter are DSP-based. That may be a bit difficult to mod ...

If it's made like the digital reverb and the digital delay, it may use a Atmega8 microcontroller for the knobs and bypass, and a V1000 DSP. It would be possible to re-program the DSP for more effects.
Some other Behringer pedals are Line-6 knockoffs, the "xxx machine" series. I remember seing somewhere here that these use a BlackFin DSP, can someone confirm this ?
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Post by CHEEZOR »

I guess what I was thinking about by "mod ideas" was like making a foot controller for some of the knobs. In harmony mode if you had a foot controller for the knob that controls the pitch of the added signal then you would get foot-controlled arpeggiation. I tried turning the knob while some one else was playing and I thought it was a very cool effect. There were some other knobs that I thought would be cool to be controlled externally as well, although I cant remember which ones at the moment. I guess I was thinking it would be really cool to be able to have a switch on the external foot controller to be able to change which knob you wanted the controller to control. I was also thinking that you could rehouse the pedal inside the foot controller housing. How possible do you think this is? I have an extra Dunlop wah housing at the moment... :D

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Post by ansil »

yes you are correct you can do this. i did something similar with my wammy pedal a while back well like ten years lol

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Post by afortunado »

I just bought this piece of crap and want to do some mods too. Im from Costa Rica so I didnt have a chance to test it before buying it online but it was supposed to be a clone of Boss PS-5 which I tested before and was ok.
I also have a case of an old dunlop cry baby and was trying to put the circuit inside and use the Hot Pot connected directly to the expression pedal input but the impedance of the hot pot is too high to work on it (100K ohms) and the circuit uses a low impedance pot so I'm not pretty sure if there is any pot with the same value to fit in the case and make this thing to work as a Whammy.

There are 2 thing I really want to fix in this pedal if someone has any idea to share I will appreciate it because this pedal will be out of my rig soon and probably in the garbage can:
1) Tone sucking when turned "on": I dont want to make the thing through bypass but at least sound at the same level when is on than bypassed any boost circuit recommended to put it in? something adjustable that I can control with an extra Nob for level of volume
2) It is slow to react, I mean after pressing it will take too long for the effect to come in: Since its a DSP device I'm not sure if there is a way to fix this.

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Post by JiM »

afortunado wrote: use the Hot Pot connected directly to the expression pedal input but the impedance of the hot pot is too high to work on it (100K ohms) and the circuit uses a low impedance pot so I'm not pretty sure if there is any pot with the same value to fit in the case and make this thing to work as a Whammy.
Any pot, wired as a voltage divider (i.e. with 3 wires) can control such an expression input. One end of the pot goes to +5V or +9V, the other end is grounded, and the wiper goes to the input of the microcontroller or DSP. That input has a high impedance, it's only a measure of the voltage on the wiper.
The various pot values will only be a matter of taper.
afortunado wrote:any boost circuit recommended to put it in? something adjustable that I can control with an extra Nob for level of volume
There is plenty of boosters 'round here. Maybe the Crackle-Not-Okay from Soulsonic ?
afortunado wrote:2) It is slow to react, I mean after pressing it will take too long for the effect to come in: Since its a DSP device I'm not sure if there is a way to fix this.
Seems hard to fix indeed. I guess it's made such as the DSP needs some time to buffer samples before stretching them ...

Can you please post a couple of pictures of the PCB, or at least tell us the part number of the DSP ? Is it a CoolAudio V1000 or something else ?
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Post by afortunado »

Thank you Jim I will take a look on those circuits I´m specially interested in the booster. I will post some pictures before end of week of the PCB, hope you can find something interesting to do with it.

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Post by CHEEZOR »

afortunado wrote:Thank you Jim I will take a look on those circuits I´m specially interested in the booster. I will post some pictures before end of week of the PCB, hope you can find something interesting to do with it.
I wont be home till the end of the week, but I could also take pics of mine if needed. I didnt notice any delay in mine, but I haven't had a lot of time to play with it yet. When does it happen? When you turn the effect on?

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Post by dellamorte »

If it's made like the digital reverb and the digital delay, it may use a Atmega8 microcontroller for the knobs and bypass, and a V1000 DSP. It would be possible to re-program the DSP for more effects.
i know its an old thread but could you point me towards some resourses on how to do this ?
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Post by JiM »

It turns out that the US600 is in the "RSM" range of Behringer pedals. This stands for "Real Soud Modelling", and means they are copies of Line6 pedals, not Boss. Therefore they use a Freescale DSP (a 56364), not the V1000, not a BlackFin either (those are in EHX products).

I have a BSY600 open on the bench right now, and i plan to trace (some of) it. There is still an Atmega for "user interface", but i don't know yet where the DSP code is stored. If it's inside the Atmega and its lock bits are set, it might be tricky to dump it.

Detailed gutshots of any RSM pedal are welcome !
If you're ready to loose the original program, it might be a low-cost alternative to the ToneCore DSP.
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Post by tuck »

JiM wrote:It turns out that the US600 is in the "RSM" range of Behringer pedals. This stands for "Real Soud Modelling", and means they are copies of Line6 pedals, not Boss. Therefore they use a Freescale DSP (a 56364), not the V1000, not a BlackFin either (those are in EHX products).

I have a BSY600 open on the bench right now, and i plan to trace (some of) it. There is still an Atmega for "user interface", but i don't know yet where the DSP code is stored. If it's inside the Atmega and its lock bits are set, it might be tricky to dump it.

Detailed gutshots of any RSM pedal are welcome !
If you're ready to loose the original program, it might be a low-cost alternative to the ToneCore DSP.
The Behringer SO400 is also a "RSM" pedal but it looks and behaves like the Boss OC-3. Except for the poly mode which is utterly crap that couldn't be compared to the poly mode of the Boss pedal. And as well the enclosure/knobs are not worth to spend the money for it.

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Post by CHEEZOR »

Sorry, it has been a long time since I have posted on here. I never took any gut shots because life got in the way and there didn't seem to be much interest in this one when I first posted it. I just opened mine, but it is late. Pics in the morning/afternoon. Just to clarify, the DSP is a Freescale. Says "DSPB56364FU100" on the first line of the chip. So Im guessing this is the same as the previously mentioned 56364. There is also a chip that says: "ATMEGA16L" on the first line and "8AU0639J" on the second line if my eyes are correct. Mine also has a 5 pin socket above the pots, labeled X1, which appears to be missing from JiM's pics of the BSY600.

Anyway, pics tomorrow, I promise. Sorry for taking so long.

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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

Sorry. Plain out of planes.

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Post by CHEEZOR »

Ok, as promised. Here are the gut shots of my US600. If anyone needs clarifications on any of the parts then let me know. I'll leave it disassembled for a bit.

It looks like there is a ram chip, IS41LV16105B-60TL, and the datasheet for it can be found here: http://www.htmldatasheet.com/issi/is41lv16105b60tl.htm.
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Post by JiM »

tuck wrote:he Behringer SO400 is also a "RSM" pedal but it looks and behaves like the Boss OC-3.
You're right, i was generalizing too much. The BSY600 is also a copy of a Boss SYB-5.
But circuit-wise, all RSM seem to be built around the same Freescale DSP, which is the same as the one Line6 uses.
Do you know which DSP powers Boss pedals ? IRRC it's a custom-made chip, probably built by NEC or Toshiba, along with a Mitsubishi microcontroller.
Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Interesting
In https://www.freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=11630&p=125329&hilit=DSPB56364%2A#p125329 Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Line6 DM-4's, DL-4's and all other variants use a DSPB56364AF100 DSP made by Freescale
Are you somehow suggesting that some Line6 firmware might end up, even partially, in some cheap plastic enclosure ?
That would be huge ! :twisted:
CHEEZOR wrote:Ok, as promised. Here are the gut shots of my US600.
Thanks Cheezor ! Apart from the DRAM, and one pot less, the layout looks very similar to the BSY600. This should be easy to trace, by analogy. You may also correct some errors i probably did.
I'll take a closer look at your gutshots, but finding out the things between the jacks is almost impossible even on the best pictures : a pair of eyes next to the board is required. [smilie=a_holyshit.gif]
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Post by why me »

Hi everyone!

My US-600 won't turn on and a friend who's an electronic engineer went as far as he could w/o the schematics.

I'd love to resuscitate this old pedal as a substitute will cost more than what I can afford at the moment.

If someone could point to the download of the schematic for a similar pedal based on the same eeprom (but programmed let's say to be a delay instead) I assume it would still work to diagnose the non-power situation with this pedal and it would save the life of a nice looking pedal.

I would be thankful for your input to bypass this malfunction. Your feedback will be very welcome and it will not be suppressed by any notch filter. If you take long in replying please do not apologize for the delay nor for the reverb as this is rather a pitch shifter harmonizer.

Regards!

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Post by why me »

133 views!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

Can anyone please put me in the right direction?


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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

Let me give you first shot then ;-)
I do not know this pedal and I do not know what's inside. That makes it hard to start off directly. What I do know is that the "brothers" of this pedal are either based on a Coolaudio V1000 DSP (Example: DD400) or a Freescale DSP56364. I order to direct you further I'd like to know from you which of the 2 platforms your pedal is based on. Photo's of the pedals inside may help as well.

edit.
I could have used the search button..... It's the Freescale variant. Use the DD600 as referfence and let us knw if that does't work.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24958&p=263903&hilit=DD600#p263903
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Post by toneman »

hello whyme!
i have one of these pedals. I was gonna say just buy another, but, to my considerable surprise, they are out of production!!
I bought mine for $50bucks. Now, I see prices going up to $200bucks :shock:
Did U buy it used?
I'm wondering HOW your "engineer friend" actually checked out your nonworking unit(?)
Did he/she use a power supply, with correct polarity and voltage OR a 9v battery?
Did he/she use an amp/guitar with good cables?
Did he/she use a scope to track/trace the signal?
U said "won't turn on". Did u have a plug in the input jack? DOes the LED light up?
I just saw a used US600 on ebay for $20 + shipping.
These are neat little units. Guess they seem to be clones of a BOSS PS-5.
Maybe U can go thru the things that were done to test the unit??
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