Daphon - E20DL Delay

A forum devoted to mod, tips and suggestions for upgrading and rehousing your VERY CHEAP commercial stompbox to near boutique excellence.
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Scruffie
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Post by Scruffie »

Igloo wrote:Nice.
Ok well just from AM's site-

You need a 10k trim pot to go into the R18 slot - please have a look at R19 can you see if it is in series with the R18 holes? Not sure where R20 goes. Please follw the traces for those and see.
And a V3205 to double the delay time- Small Bear has them for $4.95 this is virtually zero sum because you will get to keep the BL3208 for another great usage.
I don't have time at the moment to sit down and go through it but there will be another resistor/trimmer replacement too.

With two trims and a V3205 you will be greatly down the path.
Just having a look at the underside right now... R20 doesn't appear to be connected to anything theres some caps further down the track but at the top it just stops... and yea think R18 & 19 are in series (I've had a few beers so someone should probably double check this when working on it.

As for the trimmer behind the caps thats where (I think it's R11 &12 are) and these are both 6.8k so you'd be wanting a 20k trimmer (Upon further inspection of this it appears theres actually a symbol of a trimmer to put on here so I recon this is probably the more important part and they just chose to be cheap and not set it correctly

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Post by Scruffie »

Sorry for the long string of posts, but I keep passing the amount of time left to edit the threads and drinking is fueling my interest in this pedal, quick observations, could be nothing...

In the Tony Smith Version, this is only speculation but the Cap C9 appears to be much bigger in size, now I know size doesn't equal value but all the other caps seem the same as mine except that one which is far bigger and analogman has changed his too (admitedly to a higher quality one but different in colour to the other ones I notice...) so I just wonder if this cap may hold some significance in the tone or just a plain coincidence?

Second.. Analogman has covered his chips, looking at the schematic of the original DM-2 (I think this is almost a cross between a DM-2 & DM-3 Speculation again not being knowledgeable in these things) the DM-2 Uses a MN3101... so what would happen if you changed the MN3102 in the pedal to a MN3101? I know it's only the clock driver but would it not work, not worth doing? etc...

Also probably nothing but a brand thing as with the size of the cap again, but in the Tony Smith pictures, the 571 chip has been changed to an NE model rather than SA (Also in the images of the AR20DL without the label on it, it's been socketed and isn't the same as the stock chip like the 4207 is), once again probably purely due to the stocking of the company but would this prove to have any quality difference or is it neglible

Finally, for anyone that feels the need to move the Repeat knob back one like Analogman, theres a hole predrilled inside for doing this... personally I don't see why you'd want to but there you go.

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205
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Post by 205 »

How did you go with your 3205 chip?
I'm having troubles with mine sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
I don't know if it's a faulty chip or some kind of compatibility issue.

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Post by Scruffie »

I haven't got mine yet, i'm in the U.K and it's gotta come from america, plus it doesn't help that I haven't got round to ordering till today (had to wait for someone on ebay to pay) but that doesn't sound too promising... perhaps the MN3101 is neccesary for it? Although I think it should be fine... I'l find out in assuming around 10-12 days or whenever it arrives...

I dunno really are you sure it's socketed properly? and if you soldered it, did you accidently damage it? Have you fine tuned it with the 2 trimmers yet? Perhaps this will help, keep us posted.

Btw Before I place my order today, does anyone know if an V571 will perform better than the stock SA571 Chip? Or would I just be wasting my money?

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Post by Scruffie »

Anyone wanna chip in on 205's issue? Just before I order the chip is the MN3101 suggested for the V3205 to function properly (this is my first trip into delay territory and I wanna do it in one order due to the distance, time and shipping costs) and will I get better results with the V571 rather than the Stock SA571 (I realise the SA is more expensive on small bear... but that doesn't neccessarily make it better)

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Post by Fuzzer »

Dudes, check this thread for gutshots of the analogMan's version of the Daphon delay.

https://www.freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=6214
The Freestompboxes Forum search function is soo great, use the search function..., the S E A R C H function.

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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

Scruffie wrote:Anyone wanna chip in on 205's issue? Just before I order the chip is the MN3101 suggested for the V3205 to function properly (this is my first trip into delay territory and I wanna do it in one order due to the distance, time and shipping costs) and will I get better results with the V571 rather than the Stock SA571 (I realise the SA is more expensive on small bear... but that doesn't neccessarily make it better)

get a MN3201 at least!
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

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Post by IggY »

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:
Scruffie wrote:Anyone wanna chip in on 205's issue? Just before I order the chip is the MN3101 suggested for the V3205 to function properly (this is my first trip into delay territory and I wanna do it in one order due to the distance, time and shipping costs) and will I get better results with the V571 rather than the Stock SA571 (I realise the SA is more expensive on small bear... but that doesn't neccessarily make it better)

get a MN3201 at least!
:slap:

Scruffie: better get a MN3102 instead! :thumbsup (3102 be it MN, V or BL)

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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

:(

Pwned
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Post by Scruffie »

Lol oh so I got the numbers the wrong way round, well the pedal already has a MN3102 In it so no issue there (plus I already ordered so tooo late now)

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Post by Scruffie »

Hooray my V3205 came from smallbear today, nice and fast post (although beaten by my items from taiwan) so I shall now begin the modding of my E20DL and find out if I have the same issues as 205 (I have 2 trims so i'l see if tuning is where your issue lies, as seen on fuzzers thread it can now be seen that the NE is now a 570... dunno what difference that makes)

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Post by 205 »

Keep us posted Scruffie

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Post by Scruffie »

Shall do, been to inhebriated to do it today (a party has carried over in my body from yesterday) but shall try out mods tommorow (got a party in the evening again though, i'm too old for all this)

Also got an OPA2134A & an LM833 to try out in the 4558 spot, see if that does some good.

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Post by Scruffie »

Just tried the V3205 in place of the BL3208, a definite improvement, the pots seem to be alot more useful in controlling in an amount of delay now too, not noticed the problem you mentioned 205, shall be soldering the trimmers in soon though & putting a chip socket in the 4558 spot (I see analogman sockets the 4558... but keeps it stock... perhaps it wasn't much use changing it to an higher quality chip, or it was just what was cheaper)

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Post by Scruffie »

Continued... right doing this at half 3 in the morning probably wasn't a good idea, but... I took out the 2 resistors to replace them with a trimmer only to realise my trimmers are huge in comparisson and that I will need to find somewhere that stocks iccle ones...

2n'd Tried to remove the JRC to socket it about 20 times but the solder cooled before my sucker had a chance so i'm guessin i'm gunna need more than a 30 watt iron to attempt that...

So all round, epic fail, except the V3205... which is awesome and I will give this another go when I have more cash for an order and a better iron (unless I have a higher rated one elsewhere... wouldn't be a needle tip mind, flathead. Probably also wait for soulsonics news on true bypassing one)

Time to clean up and go to sleep (argh a bit of wire has gotten under my space key so I can't press it easily)

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Post by Fuzzer »

Hey Scruffie, have you tried using braid (solder wick) to remove IC's?, I find it much better thatn the solder sucker, try it and see if it does the trick for you too.
The Freestompboxes Forum search function is soo great, use the search function..., the S E A R C H function.

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Post by Scruffie »

No I haven't, to be honest I haven't even seen desolder braid in the U.K so I guess i'l have to order it in future...

I'm getting distortion from that JRC chip now anyway surprise, surprise, so it's gotta go somehow.

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Post by stratomaster »

I've done all the basic mods that can be seen from the pictures of the An@L0gman Delay in the other post (minus the compander and delay chip change--they're in the mail). I was also able to eliminate a good bit of the squeal at higher delay times with a few part substitutions. I'll document them below.

Replace R18 and R19 w/ a 10k trim pot (bend the leads to get it to fit, or drill the PCB as AM does)
Replace the two resistors in the middle of the cap jungle w/ a 10k trim pot (it's already shaped for you)
Replace all power filter caps with ones that are at least twice the value (whether it makes a difference, I don't know but I did it and my squeal is pretty much gone, so I'm including it)
Replace C2 with a 1N400X diode
C34 is known to go bad -- preemptively change it to a film cap of the same value (103)
Change as many of the 1uF and 0.47uF electros to film as you can afford to
Replace C1 with a larger value (I used 0.047 uF)

:Back of board jumpering:
Jumper from pos leg of C37 to inboard leg of R2 and cut the trace that connects R2 to Q2 and C2.
Jumper from inboard leg of IC6 (transistor) to near leg of R45 and then clip R45 out of the circuit (remove it completely) on the component side *this really helped with the squeal at higher delay times*
Add a diode from leg 2 (counting from the corner towards the center) of the 3102 chip to the square shaped pad on the delay chip to the near leg of J2 (see AM delay gutshot picture viewtopic.php?f=7&t=6214 )
Jumper from the outboard leg of IC6 to the near leg of Z1.

And what cleared up the last remaining squeal was changing the JRC4558 w/ a TL072.

Now all I gotta do is put in the compander and V3201 and it'll be all ready to go on my pedal board.

By the way, does anyone know how to piggy-back delay chips for added delay time? I ordered 2 v3201s for this very purpose, but I understand it's a bit more involved than op-amp stacking.

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Post by stratomaster »

Spoke too soon, squeal is back. Very weird. I can control it with my vol and tone knobs on the guitar though. Any ideas?

stratomaster wrote:I've done all the basic mods that can be seen from the pictures of the An@L0gman Delay in the other post (minus the compander and delay chip change--they're in the mail). I was also able to eliminate a good bit of the squeal at higher delay times with a few part substitutions. I'll document them below.

Replace R18 and R19 w/ a 10k trim pot (bend the leads to get it to fit, or drill the PCB as AM does)
Replace the two resistors in the middle of the cap jungle w/ a 10k trim pot (it's already shaped for you)
Replace all power filter caps with ones that are at least twice the value (whether it makes a difference, I don't know but I did it and my squeal is pretty much gone, so I'm including it)
Replace C2 with a 1N400X diode
C34 is known to go bad -- preemptively change it to a film cap of the same value (103)
Change as many of the 1uF and 0.47uF electros to film as you can afford to
Replace C1 with a larger value (I used 0.047 uF)

:Back of board jumpering:
Jumper from pos leg of C37 to inboard leg of R2 and cut the trace that connects R2 to Q2 and C2.
Jumper from inboard leg of IC6 (transistor) to near leg of R45 and then clip R45 out of the circuit (remove it completely) on the component side *this really helped with the squeal at higher delay times*
Add a diode from leg 2 (counting from the corner towards the center) of the 3102 chip to the square shaped pad on the delay chip to the near leg of J2 (see AM delay gutshot picture viewtopic.php?f=7&t=6214 )
Jumper from the outboard leg of IC6 to the near leg of Z1.

And what cleared up the last remaining squeal was changing the JRC4558 w/ a TL072.

Now all I gotta do is put in the compander and V3201 and it'll be all ready to go on my pedal board.

By the way, does anyone know how to piggy-back delay chips for added delay time? I ordered 2 v3201s for this very purpose, but I understand it's a bit more involved than op-amp stacking.

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Post by Scruffie »

Is C34 known to go bad? What's it for.

And for that matter, what does replacing C2 with a diode accomplish? Why was C2 there originally and what's C1 for? Before I go replacing components in mine.

Still wanna try and true bypass this pedal too, I noticed delays even when the pedal was off with high gains infront of it, could be my heat damaged JRC4558 though, which will be replaced when I finally get some solder braid.

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