Friedman BE-OD Pedal  [traced]

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bmxguitarsbmx
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Post by bmxguitarsbmx »

The voltages you posted indicate a short somewhere. Between resistances.

U1 is saturated, so you will not have sound. A basic electronics trouble shooting book would be a great investment, for you and rmroza.

One lesson to consider is that getting the correct parts (16mm pots, 1/4watt resistors, correct values parts with correct spacing, and socketing IC's) will go a long way to avoid problems. Hope that is helpful.

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alltrax
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Post by alltrax »

bmxguitarsbmx wrote:The voltages you posted indicate a short somewhere. Between resistances.

U1 is saturated, so you will not have sound. A basic electronics trouble shooting book would be a great investment, for you and rmroza.

One lesson to consider is that getting the correct parts (16mm pots, 1/4watt resistors, correct values parts with correct spacing, and socketing IC's) will go a long way to avoid problems. Hope that is helpful.
Yes I agree, I built over 200 pedals but still have to learn a lot (no sarcasm)
All the parts I used are correct (well, except that the board is designed for 1/8w resistors), but right, I should have socketed the ICs (it's the first time I don't actually :roll: :D )
I might end probing the circuit

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Post by Jan1966 »

bmxguitarsbmx wrote:The voltages you posted indicate a short somewhere. Between resistances.

U1 is saturated, so you will not have sound. A basic electronics trouble shooting book would be a great investment, for you and rmroza.

One lesson to consider is that getting the correct parts (16mm pots, 1/4watt resistors, correct values parts with correct spacing, and socketing IC's) will go a long way to avoid problems. Hope that is helpful.
I agree
IC's are probably heat damaged due to not socketing. Now you have to try to desolder them without destroying the pads.
Shouldn't rush.

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Post by jalmonsalmon »

bmxguitarsbmx wrote:The voltages you posted indicate a short somewhere. Between resistances.

U1 is saturated, so you will not have sound. A basic electronics trouble shooting book would be a great investment, for you and rmroza.

One lesson to consider is that getting the correct parts (16mm pots, 1/4watt resistors, correct values parts with correct spacing, and socketing IC's) will go a long way to avoid problems. Hope that is helpful.
Resistors for Buggs build uses 1/8 watt resistors...
kind of sucks cramming STANDARD 1/4 watter resistors with this PCB however you can buy 3.5mm 1/4 resistors or even 1/6 watters from mouser :mrgreen:

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Post by bmxguitarsbmx »

alltrax wrote:
bmxguitarsbmx wrote:The voltages you posted indicate a short somewhere. Between resistances.

U1 is saturated, so you will not have sound. A basic electronics trouble shooting book would be a great investment, for you and rmroza.

One lesson to consider is that getting the correct parts (16mm pots, 1/4watt resistors, correct values parts with correct spacing, and socketing IC's) will go a long way to avoid problems. Hope that is helpful.
Yes I agree, I built over 200 pedals but still have to learn a lot (no sarcasm)
All the parts I used are correct (well, except that the board is designed for 1/8w resistors), but right, I should have socketed the ICs (it's the first time I don't actually :roll: :D )
I might end probing the circuit
I want you to get your pedal working. Don't give up. It could be cleaner. The wrong sized resistors doesn't help nor does leaving solder flux all over the board. A clean job helps you see where you may have made a mistake. Your build and rmroza's build suffers from sloppyness. These parts are cheaper than dirt, why skimp? Is it your time that is worthless? Think of it this way: Your pedals could be around for another 50 years... On the other hand, you could be the person to blame for a live gig failure. Both your build and rmroza's build have voided any reasonable warranty with bugg. It's a mess guys. Take some pride in your work.

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Post by bmxguitarsbmx »

rmroza wrote:...some pots are working in the opposite direction! Now easy enough to change by opposite pins, but just noted this throughout the builds and on the Buggs board, some pots still are working in the opposite direction.
In all fairness, I shouldn't be giving alltrax a hardtime.

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alltrax
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Post by alltrax »

Jan1966 wrote: IC's are probably heat damaged due to not socketing. Now you have to try to desolder them without destroying the pads.
Shouldn't rush.
Honnestly I don't think so, contact for les than a 1/4s with the iron on each pin shoukd not fry it. But I will fore sure continue socketing them on my next builds

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Post by alltrax »

bmxguitarsbmx wrote:I want you to get your pedal working. Don't give up. It could be cleaner. The wrong sized resistors doesn't help nor does leaving solder flux all over the board. A clean job helps you see where you may have made a mistake. Your build and rmroza's build suffers from sloppyness. These parts are cheaper than dirt, why skimp? Is it your time that is worthless? Think of it this way: Your pedals could be around for another 50 years... On the other hand, you could be the person to blame for a live gig failure. Both your build and rmroza's build have voided any reasonable warranty with bugg. It's a mess guys. Take some pride in your work.
What parts are cheaper than dirt ? And where do you see flux all over my board ?
Again, real questions, i'd be happy to improve my builds :wink:

So far I checked the connections on half the schematic, except U1 pin 2 they are ok

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Post by andlord »

1/8w resistors are dirt cheap...it would have improved the look overall and it is much easier to debug if you have everything in place snugly.

On the other hand I did not use sockets on a bunch of builds and never had problems with it. I don't think your op amps are damaged because of heat(which does not mean that they couldn't be damaged in another way)

What exactly is wrong with that u1 connection?

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Post by alltrax »

andlord wrote:1/8w resistors are dirt cheap...it would have improved the look overall and it is much easier to debug if you have everything in place snugly.

On the other hand I did not use sockets on a bunch of builds and never had problems with it. I don't think your op amps are damaged because of heat(which does not mean that they couldn't be damaged in another way)

What exactly is wrong with that u1 connection?
I used regular 1/4w resistors, they fit like standing resistors on the board, not an issue for soldering but makes things harder for troubleshooting as I have access to one of the 2 solder only by underneath the board.

I have no connectivity between U1 pin 2 and R4/R5. I put a jumper but still wrong voltage on U1-1 and no sound at all. I'm in the process of checking all the connections on the board

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Post by alltrax »

Ok except U1-2 all the other connections are good
All the Vref from the schematic are also ok
Next step : checking components values

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Post by alltrax »

All component values are ok.
On a side note (this has nothing to do with my issue I suppose), I noticed C13 on the board is not on the schematic. I checked the connections, it's // to C25 and R33

Next step will be replacing U1, maybe a bad TL072 ?

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Post by jalmonsalmon »

alltrax wrote:All component values are ok.
On a side note (this has nothing to do with my issue I suppose), I noticed C13 on the board is not on the schematic. I checked the connections, it's // to C25 and R33

Next step will be replacing U1, maybe a bad TL072 ?

C13 is parallel with C25

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Post by bancika »

jalmonsalmon wrote: kind of sucks cramming STANDARD 1/4 watter resistors :
yeah, I agree. But those are the smallest I can get where I live. I'll probably just install them vertically, like old boss or ibanez pedals.

like this http://medias.audiofanzine.com/images/n ... 735446.jpg
The new version of DIY Layout Creator is out, check it out - https://github.com/bancika/diy-layout-creator
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Post by J0K3RX »

Try using an audio probe... It has helped me with many issues including no output :wink:

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Post by alltrax »

I removed U1 and replaced it with a new one (socketed), and soldered a wire at that bad U1-2 / R4-R5 connection
Voltages around pin 1-3 are now different, but still off :
Before 8.6; 1.35; 3.1, now 1.36; 3.4; 1.11
All the other voltages including the 2 other ICs are good

I plugged it in my amp, well with all pots maxed I can now barely ear some clean sound with a lot of shhhhhh (chug in english ?)
Using a prob will sure help, I will probably try next week-end but I feel I checked and rechecked everything. Maybe time to move to something else and come back later with fresh eyes...

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Post by picatostas »

Finally ! When I tried the pedal in March, I thought, there is a layout in inet for sure, but no, there wasnt then, so first, thanks for your work. I wouldve loved to had the money for purchase and reverse engineering it with you guys. I ordered 2 boards from Bugg, and made the component purchase at Musikding, the only thing that I completely forgot was about the pcb mount angled pots Haha, I always buy the ones with solder lugs... :roll: Anyways, im really looking forward to make the build and share results with you all, even a Youtube review or something like. Its been a long time since I didnt build a pedal, i'm on the DIY train again !! :horsey:

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Post by bmxguitarsbmx »

alltrax wrote: What parts are cheaper than dirt ? And where do you see flux all over my board ?
Again, real questions, i'd be happy to improve my builds :wink:

So far I checked the connections on half the schematic, except U1 pin 2 they are ok
All the parts are cheaper than the time you are wasting trying to repair a board you damaged.

I see flux all over the bottom of the board in the second photo you posted!

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Post by bmxguitarsbmx »

alltrax wrote:...
Voltages around pin 1-3 are now different, but still off :
Before 8.6; 1.35; 3.1, now 1.36; 3.4; 1.11
...
It does seem weird that u1a is first pegged to the upper rail, now pegged to the lower rail...

Couple things to try:
Check voltage on both sides of R2 470k. Both sides should be ~4.5V.

Lift R4. This will turn u1 into a unity gain buffer. See if pin 1,2,3 then settle to ~4.5V.

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Post by bajaman »

Have you got the correct dual op amp fitted ? Is it orientated correctly ?
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