Sola Sound - Tonebender Mark II Professional  [schematic]

Discussion regarding early stompbox technology: 1960-1975 Please keep discussion focused and contribute what info you have...
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Electric Warrior
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Post by Electric Warrior »

the drivers sure seem to have a very raspy character. I have one OC82D and it sounds very different from the other OC types I have tried in a Rangemaster circuit.

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Post by JimiB »

Hoorah, with a hangover (the only time for me to work with ToneBenders...) I've finally finished my MkII with 2 OC81D and one OC81, could only bias it down to 4.6v but that's good enough
try biasing it up to about 7V and let us know how it sounds - this is closer to vintage tonebender MKII according to david main

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Post by Electric Warrior »

:thumbsup exactly. see page 3 of this this thread.

David recently explained how he biases the circuit: https://stompboxes.co.uk/forum/viewtopic ... e&start=10 (that trim pot is at Q2's collector btw..)

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Post by Scruffie »

Oh it's easy to get it to 7v infact... no biasing required really, 7 sounded more harsh in a good way, but 4.5V had its charm aswell... It was only quick testing, i'l have to do it thorougly on the morrow, I just went from one source for the 4.5V.

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Post by Electric Warrior »

don't believe that source ;)
Many believe that Q2 and Q3 are supposed to be biased like a fuzz face and Q1 like a rangemaster. That didn't work for me at all. Sounded thin, lifeless and buzzy.

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Post by Scruffie »

Lol I didn't beleive that source actually, I searched on here and didn't notice it said 7v, then saw a schematic that said 4.5v and thought i'd try, it lost some bite but was still good, the ear always wins in the end think I need to find a happy medium between thrashy dirt and smooth fuzz tones for this.

I'm not checking Q2, just biasing Q3 collector to whatever sounds good and tbh, most of it does and changing round the same set of transistors (let alone my baggy of other ones) makes a huge difference, gunna take some time on this one, i've even kinda lost sense of what sounds good and just what sounds tone bender now lol.

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Post by Electric Warrior »

I know how you feel :mrgreen:
this is what you're aiming for :wink: : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T12wRBAhcTY

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Post by Scruffie »

Ooo that's much better, I was going by the Babe i'm gunna leave you chorus, which was harder to tell, that dazed and confused sound if I remember from yesterday was around 6V, so many good tones, so much impatience.

Around 2:30 on this solo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP9xMobANJM good tones...

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Post by Electric Warrior »

Sonic VI knows his tone benders as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdpaUxuyAuU (I believe the third switch position is the MKII)
and this Marshall Supa Fuzz sure sounds sweet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VnwDqK0 ... re=related

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Post by Scruffie »

I think the Tone Bender is just that.. bias it to your tone... but I think it also makes your tone so perhaps I should make it do something completely different.

The Sonic VI sounds like a worse version of mine... which is good on my part, i'm also playing through a reallyyy bad SS amp... need tubes to tune it properly tbh, just using what I have to hand... (can't wait to get my Vox Night Train)

The Marshalls the same effect but with just a few value changes isn't it?... anyway it all sounds good... I can't even decide anymore lol, they each have there charm, as does alot of settings on mine.

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Post by Electric Warrior »

The early ones are exactly the same as the MKII. Later ones have 10µF electrolytics instead of 5µF and no capacitor from input to ground.
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Marshall Supa Fuzz.png

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Post by Scruffie »

Oh speaking of exactly the same I put a 10k Resistor in parallel with my 1Meg Log Pot and the sweep seems reallyy even, I don't know if the level sweep was an issue on the level of normal tone benders, but thought i'd mention it.

So it is basically the same, well i'm happy with mine anyway, just gotta tune it to my favourite now, cheers for the help and info E-W (hope you don't mind be abbreviating your name lol) if I get a chance in the studio i'l record the different OC transistors... (this may take up to a year as i'm mainly working there...)

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Post by sonicvi »

I don't really know MK2's all that well actually, but the pedal in that video does sound much better in person than that crappy video.

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Post by Electric Warrior »

I really like what I hear in your clip :)
this one on the other hand.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNFDneLX ... re=related :scratch: :shock: though it sounds as if there might have been no amp involved...

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Post by highway jones »

Using Andy"s layout below I put together a NPN pos. ground version of an MKII. It's tuned and sounds quite well using Smallbear's Ge's. The only issue is I'd like it to have a bit more high end and possibly a bit more rasp. Where should I experiment with getting a bit more high end (the 0.1 cap?)? As for more of a raspy tone, is that primarily a function of the transistors or can I change a few components to squeeze this out?

Thanks....

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Post by Electric Warrior »

Just leave away the 0.01µF cap from input to ground to make it more trebly.

And you could try the original resistor values to see if they work better with your transistor setup.

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Post by phibes »

Drop the resistor going to the collector of Q2 for a 100k trimpot. (Use 100k for either OC75 or OC81d version obviously) You'll be able to squeeze more of that raspiness outta it. I know exactly what you're talking about. I was actually going to post that earlier but the thread slipped my mind. I think the trimmer on Q2's collector was mentioned earlier and just kind of ended there. I'm usually stubborn and try to keep all the values to stock but the 100k trimmer makes getting a good bias go a lot faster (drops the need of sitting and trying out a full bag of germs too) and you can control the voltage to Q3's collector in a more "elegant fashion" as my friend Trudy would say. As mentioned earlier 7.8v - 8.2v is the sweet spot. Dave Main been's using it for a reason. I took the 100k resistor out on a board with OC81d's I did a while and I got a way better sound of it. It was good before hand but I was real surprised at how much better it sounded with the resistance at around 40k-50k. I can draw the current DAM mkii layout up if anyone wants it.
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Post by The Rotagilla »

phibes wrote:As mentioned earlier 7.8v - 8.2v is the sweet spot. Dave Main been's using it for a reason.
So why is it that 4.5v is stuck in my head? :scratch:
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Post by Electric Warrior »

That's what is often recommended for the Fuzz Face.
In a Tone Bender circuit it didn't really work for me. Sounded very thin and buzzy.

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Post by jrod »

phibes wrote:I can draw the current DAM mkii layout up if anyone wants it.
I'd like to see it! :P

Thanks

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