Millenium bypass question

All frequent questions on switching: true or not true bypass, transistor-based or mechanical.
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darrenbkl@gmail.com
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Post by darrenbkl@gmail.com »

In the Millenium bypass version 2,which diode should I use for the low leakage diode jsut below the 1N914/1N4148?

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schemripper
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Post by schemripper »

I think you need this.

There are two diodes on the Millenium 2- a 1N914/1N4148 and an LED.

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darrenbkl@gmail.com
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Post by darrenbkl@gmail.com »

haha thx :applause:
any problem with the Millenium C?

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Post by darrenbkl@gmail.com »

another question - does different colour of LED used in the clipping section produce different tone?
In building a project -wat kind of resistor should we use (type,power rating,tolerance....) and how about the tolerance of the caps?

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Post by TragicTravisty »

its pretty much accepted that tolerance isnt too important in stompbox builds... but the higher the tolerance the higher the 'mojo' and less differences between 2 of the same boxes. yes LED alters frequency response, i dont know how or why or if its even audible, but soem people here do.

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Post by Fuzzer »

I thought the mojo-rule-of-thumb stated that the more variability, the more mojo you had; hence, tighter tolerances - 'less mojo'. But anyways...

Regardind the LED influence, it has more to do with the forward voltage of the diode, which is what determines when the signal gets cut. Other thing that may have influence is the way current flows across the diode, so it may determine some distortion characteristics. So, for the LEDs, different colors mean different forfard voltage values, but is not related to the frecuency associated to the color of the LED.

This thing was discussed in other thread, I don't quite remember where but it was explained pretty well by member Soulsonic, look for it and you'll get better explanation.
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Post by Barcode »

schemripper wrote:I think you need this.

There are two diodes on the Millenium 2- a 1N914/1N4148 and an LED.
no, there are two diodes IN ADDITION to the LED. a low leakage and a high leakage. the low leakage is best suited (or at least most prefer) to be the base-collector junction of an npn transistor, the most popular for this purpose seems to be the 2n3904.

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Post by schemripper »

Barcode wrote:
schemripper wrote:I think you need this.

There are two diodes on the Millenium 2- a 1N914/1N4148 and an LED.
no, there are two diodes IN ADDITION to the LED. a low leakage and a high leakage. the low leakage is best suited (or at least most prefer) to be the base-collector junction of an npn transistor, the most popular for this purpose seems to be the 2n3904.
The link is to RG's schematic and parts list.

Parts list for the Millenium 2 from that document:

Q1 BS170/2N7000
Q2 2N3904
D1 1N914/1N4148
R1 & R2

and obviously a LED.

If you have modified the circuit, them it's not a Millenium Bypass, it's a derivative.

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Post by Barcode »

schemripper wrote:
Barcode wrote:
schemripper wrote:I think you need this.

There are two diodes on the Millenium 2- a 1N914/1N4148 and an LED.
no, there are two diodes IN ADDITION to the LED. a low leakage and a high leakage. the low leakage is best suited (or at least most prefer) to be the base-collector junction of an npn transistor, the most popular for this purpose seems to be the 2n3904.
The link is to RG's schematic and parts list.

Parts list for the Millenium 2 from that document:

Q1 BS170/2N7000
Q2 2N3904
D1 1N914/1N4148
R1 & R2


and obviously a LED.

If you have modified the circuit, them it's not a Millenium Bypass, it's a derivative.
Look above, "Q2" actually serves as the low leakage diode, not as a transistor. Did no one actually read the entire article?:
To cure the limitations of the Millenium 1, I came up with the Millenium 2. This version uses a MOSFET transistor, and two diodes at the input. The MOSFET has an even higher input impedance than a JFET. It's so high that it is turned on by the difference in leakage current between two diodes. The pullup diode is still a gold doped 1N914 or 1N4148, and the Mill 2 works just fine with just the one diode. I worried about protecting the gate/source against static electricity and transients. To be doubly sure that static electricity and transients don't exceed the gate-source voltage limit, the second diode acts as a clamp to ground for negative transients. The diode from ground needs to be a low leakage type so that the leakage of the pull up diode is greater and will pull the gate of the MOSFET high. While silicon power diodes work just fine for this, the cheapest low leakage diode is the collector-base junction of an ordinary NPN silicon transistor. These junctions are designed specifically for low leakage as a side effect of their transistor role, and work just fine in this application. The emitter is simply left open. An even-lower leakage junction can be found in the gate-source junction of a JFET transistor, although this does not not perform any better in this application than the NPN transistor base and costs a bit more.

Image
look at the schem for mil 2, you can clearly see two diodes and an LED.

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Post by darrenbkl@gmail.com »

emmm,i was confused :scratch:

tat means we only use the base collector junction of 2N3904 as a diode?
If correct,then where should I connect the emitter of the 2N3904?
Millenium 2 and C which one better?

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Post by Barcode »

darrenbkl@gmail.com wrote:emmm,i was confused :scratch:

tat means we only use the base collector junction of 2N3904 as a diode?
If correct,then where should I connect the emitter of the 2N3904?
Millenium 2 and C which one better?
you can either just break off the emitter (which is what i do) or if you are making a small board you can add an unconnected pad for the emitter. i haven't had the chance to try the millennium C yet, so

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Post by schemripper »

Barcode wrote: Did no one actually read the entire article?:
If you read the link that I posted, which is a later document by the same author, you will see that it is clearly shown as a transistor, not a diode.
Barcode wrote: ""Q2" actually serves as the low leakage diode, not as a transistor."
Do you admit that you are soldering a transistor onto the board? It's part number is transistor? It's listed as Q2 on the link I supplied?

No more from me on this one.

Moderator- can you please review Barcode's post and RG's information in it, given the fair use disclaimer on it, and remove if necessary to be consistent with the earlier removal? Thanks! :)

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Post by darrenbkl@gmail.com »

haha,peace peace :horsey:
i tink wat barcode trying to say is the Transistor serve the purpose as a diode with the emitter leg unused , IMO :roll:

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Post by Barcode »

schemripper wrote:
Barcode wrote: Did no one actually read the entire article?:
If you read the link that I posted, which is a later document by the same author, you will see that it is clearly shown as a transistor, not a diode.
Barcode wrote: ""Q2" actually serves as the low leakage diode, not as a transistor."
Do you admit that you are soldering a transistor onto the board? It's part number is transistor? It's listed as Q2 on the link I supplied?

No more from me on this one.

Moderator- can you please review Barcode's post and RG's information in it, given the fair use disclaimer on it, and remove if necessary to be consistent with the earlier removal? Thanks! :)
if you look at the image i posted form his website, it says "fair use only if this notice is reproduced." Since the notice is reproduced in the image...

And it isn't my fault if I have explained to you what i mean a dozen times. The OP understood what i meant, and if you read R.G.'s article you will see that any low leakage diode will work there, that is actually what the circuit dictates. the later schem shows a transistor because it has been roundly decided by many, and specifically by R.G., that the diode (or the base-collector junction if you want to get pissy about semantics) of a bipolar transistor serves this function quite well and more consistently than a regular diode, and so convention has been set that generally people will use a transistor as a diode in that spot.

If you want to troll and stir up trouble with someone who is trying to give the clearest explanation possible of a poster's question, please save that shit for TGP. Otherwise, if you will kindly refrain from getting your panties in a twist by a someone insisting on a more correct interpretation of the answer to the OP's question, that would be excellent.

FYI, my "did no one read..." comment was not directed specifically at you, it was more intended to point out that people have a tendency to ask questions about a circuit or topic that there is abundant information on, should they care to actually read the source documentation. more of a rhetorical question, so i apologize for posting it.

If a moderator deems it necessary to remove R.G.'s information in my post, that is cool. But you would do well to be a tad less childish and address the issue with either a PM to a moderator or the REPORT TO MODERATOR button. That is all you need do if your actual concern is the posting of IP without permission. Sadly, given that you decided to post it in the topic, the request seems more like a tantrum from someone who didn't like being proven wrong than a valid concern for intellectual property.
darrenbkl@gmail.com wrote:haha,peace peace :horsey:
i tink wat barcode trying to say is the Transistor serve the purpose as a diode with the emitter leg unused , IMO :roll:
Yes, that is the case. In the little board i mass produced for myself i made a pad with no other connection to it simply to solder the unused leg to, seemed more structurally sound than keeping it hanging. But yes, the emitter is unused.

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Post by borislavgajic »

I have problem........my Ibanez supertubescreamer clone works great!!!!!!!!
only it pops badly becouse millenium (bs170 mosfet) version....................................

did I do something wrong,does enyone have same problem with millenium2 :?:


heeeelp

boris

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Post by Barcode »

borislavgajic wrote:I have problem........my Ibanez supertubescreamer clone works great!!!!!!!!
only it pops badly becouse millenium (bs170 mosfet) version....................................

did I do something wrong,does enyone have same problem with millenium2 :?:


heeeelp

boris
generally the millenium given proper construction and no bum parts is quiet as a mouse. You may want to build another board and see if that takes care of it.

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Post by borislavgajic »

I solved my problem...............I used bright LED and 1k5 resistor......when I put 4k7 there is no popping :block: :slap:

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Post by flood »

ok, i have a new millenium problem:

i salvaged the millenium from a previous project and used it for my red llama clone (based on gauss markov's design).

i've checked everything, and am genuinely puzzled - the LED turns on when the effect is bypassed, and off when it is active.

furthermore, when the effect is bypassed, the LED's brightness increases when i turn down the volume.

any ideas? :scratch:
In the interest of full disclosure, I am Animal Factory Amplification.

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Post by Fuzzer »

At first I was going to say that you had the throws on the switch inverted; I mean, if you have

1 4
2 5
3 6

change the wire for 3 to 1 and viceversa; That is, the cables that operate the LED part.

But if the effect is operating correctly, then I am mistaken, but try it anyways.

--------------------------------------------

Hey, after thinking a little bit more of it, I would say now that you have swapped 'ground' and 'control' on the Millenium circuit. Check that out.
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Post by flood »

:slap:

you nailed it... that's exactly what i did! :facepalm:

thanks a bunch for the telemedical diagnosis, doc! :D will fix it up tonight and take it to practice on sunday...
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