+1mcaviel wrote:this is so retro! like in the old days right
Retro Channel - The Fuzz [traced]
- RnFR
- Old Solderhand
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now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!KHELSTROM wrote:I doubt they're"fuzz chips". Probably just a matched transistor array in a SO-14 package.RnFR wrote:so they really got some fuzz chips made?? doesn't that cost a fortune? why would you bother to do something like that other than for use as a marketing tool? ease of construction I could see, but if they are getting it all assembled smd anyway, what's the point?
oh yeah, to stop people from reverse engineering it and finding out it's most likely a Si fuzz face.
Prob. like one of these:
(the ones I reference are DIP-14 packages good for us diy'ers)
4 Matched PNP, hfe 75
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/THA ... 2bi5wyo%3D
or
2 Matched NPN hfe 100, 2 Matched PNP hfe 75
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/THA ... kVYQ%3d%3d
These are made by "That Corp." http://www.thatcorp.com/THAT_IC_Products.shtml. It was founded by Les Tyler and Gary Hebert who both formerly worked for DBX, I know atleast one of them is a guitar player and gear head too. They actually make alot of cool audio IC's, stuff like VCA's, preamps, line drivers, line recievers. A lot of big names use their stuff too. I believe the Seymour Duncan compressor is based around one of their VCA's and DBX uses their stuff too. I actually work about 5 min from their headquarters so I stopped by about 5 months ago and got a bag of free samples. After reading about the matched transistor arrays and noticing their nice low gains I immediately thought about using them for fuzz experiments. Haven't gotten around to it yet, been really busy working on other people's gear, but hopefully I'll have time soon. Can't wait to see the pics from ibodog2 and figure this one out and verify.
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- mictester
- Old Solderhand
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I found that I had a large quantity of LM3084 transistor arrays, and used them for "Superfuzz" circuits (the long-tailed pair worked brilliantly in the octave circuit). I ended up with a spare transistor in the package, and used it for a Millennium Bypass rather than waste it!RnFR wrote:Now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!
"Why is it humming?" "Because it doesn't know the words!"
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Wow! It looks like they took a belt sander to the chip.
- RnFR
- Old Solderhand
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i was thinking the same thing- millenium bypass, o/p buffer, etc. matched sets would be fantastic for octave effects for sure. what about flip flop octave downs?mictester wrote:I found that I had a large quantity of LM3084 transistor arrays, and used them for "Superfuzz" circuits (the long-tailed pair worked brilliantly in the octave circuit). I ended up with a spare transistor in the package, and used it for a Millennium Bypass rather than waste it!RnFR wrote:Now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!
"You've converted me to Cubic thinking. Where do I sign up for the newsletter? I need to learn more about how I can break free from ONEism Death Math." - Soulsonic
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Hey Guys,
Nice to see so much interest in what we are doing...
This is my first visit here. Do you do this to every manufacturers product line?
Lance Keltner
Retro Channel
Nice to see so much interest in what we are doing...
This is my first visit here. Do you do this to every manufacturers product line?
Lance Keltner
Retro Channel
- mictester
- Old Solderhand
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I've tried that too with success. The 3084 has fairly low hfe transistors in it, and they're pretty good in Fuzz Face-type circuits. I've also used them in voltage-controlled amplifiers (like the old Moog circuit), and built tremolo pedals using them.RnFR wrote:i was thinking the same thing- millenium bypass, o/p buffer, etc. matched sets would be fantastic for octave effects for sure. what about flip flop octave downs?mictester wrote:I found that I had a large quantity of LM3084 transistor arrays, and used them for "Superfuzz" circuits (the long-tailed pair worked brilliantly in the octave circuit). I ended up with a spare transistor in the package, and used it for a Millennium Bypass rather than waste it!RnFR wrote:Now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!
"Why is it humming?" "Because it doesn't know the words!"
- mictester
- Old Solderhand
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Many of them - especially the ones who goop their Tubescreamer-alike and claim that it's the Holy Grail of Tone!lance keltner wrote:Hey Guys,
Nice to see so much interest in what we are doing...
This is my first visit here. Do you do this to every manufacturers product line?
Lance Keltner
Retro Channel
"Why is it humming?" "Because it doesn't know the words!"
- polarbearfx
- Resistor Ronker
mictester wrote:I've tried that too with success. The 3084 has fairly low hfe transistors in it, and they're pretty good in Fuzz Face-type circuits. I've also used them in voltage-controlled amplifiers (like the old Moog circuit), and built tremolo pedals using them.RnFR wrote:i was thinking the same thing- millenium bypass, o/p buffer, etc. matched sets would be fantastic for octave effects for sure. what about flip flop octave downs?mictester wrote:I found that I had a large quantity of LM3084 transistor arrays, and used them for "Superfuzz" circuits (the long-tailed pair worked brilliantly in the octave circuit). I ended up with a spare transistor in the package, and used it for a Millennium Bypass rather than waste it!RnFR wrote:Now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!
Mictester your impressive. Very fast. I dig it.
- RnFR
- Old Solderhand
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welcome to the forum, Lance. here at FSB, we like to learn things by dissecting circuits (it's pretty much the only way to learn about pedals these days), and in the process sometimes we find out which manufacturer's pedals live up to the marketing hype, and which ones fall short. anything you might want to add to the technical discussion is always appreciated.lance keltner wrote:Hey Guys,
Nice to see so much interest in what we are doing...
This is my first visit here. Do you do this to every manufacturers product line?
Lance Keltner
Retro Channel
how about reverse polarity protection? buffered Vref?mictester wrote:I've tried that too with success. The 3084 has fairly low hfe transistors in it, and they're pretty good in Fuzz Face-type circuits. I've also used them in voltage-controlled amplifiers (like the old Moog circuit), and built tremolo pedals using them.RnFR wrote:i was thinking the same thing- millenium bypass, o/p buffer, etc. matched sets would be fantastic for octave effects for sure. what about flip flop octave downs?mictester wrote:I found that I had a large quantity of LM3084 transistor arrays, and used them for "Superfuzz" circuits (the long-tailed pair worked brilliantly in the octave circuit). I ended up with a spare transistor in the package, and used it for a Millennium Bypass rather than waste it!RnFR wrote:Now that makes more sense. but it sure ain't no "proprietary chip set". doesn't there have to be more than one chip for a "chip set", anyway? it is a nice looking build, but they sure did a number on that IC!
isn't this the chip that George Tripps used for the swollen pickle? i can see no real advantage in a muff, other than simplicity of design, but it did make it unique.
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- DrNomis
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ibodog2 wrote:That matches my (really screwed up) original pencil schematic. But I have no idea what Q1 and Q5 are doing there.
Aha, I think I know what Q1 and Q5 are doing, Q1 is set up as a bias current source for Q2, and Q5 is just setting the supply current for the power indicator led to a safe level...if I'm not mistaken, that is....
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- DrNomis
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Ah no, Q5 is part of a voltage divider system to divide the +9V down to a lower voltage to be supplied to Q1, which in turn develops a bias supply for Q2, and the whole point is to get it well-regulated.....
Genius is not all about 99% perspiration, and 1% inspiration - sometimes the solution is staring you right in the face.-Frequencycentral.
- Dirk_Hendrik
- Old Solderhand
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Or is Q5 supposed to be a heat source keeping the temperature and therefore the sound stable?DrNomis wrote:Ah no, Q5 is part of a voltage divider system to divide the +9V down to a lower voltage to be supplied to Q1, which in turn develops a bias supply for Q2, and the whole point is to get it well-regulated.....
- culturejam
- Old Solderhand
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The LM3064 / LM3086 seems to match up with the pins.
- culturejam
- Old Solderhand
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Okay, so if there is fancy temperature-correcting biasing going on, then......why? Why would that be a problem with silicon transistors?
- RnFR
- Old Solderhand
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or is it just there to make us go ? a deception?Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Or is Q5 supposed to be a heat source keeping the temperature and therefore the sound stable?DrNomis wrote:Ah no, Q5 is part of a voltage divider system to divide the +9V down to a lower voltage to be supplied to Q1, which in turn develops a bias supply for Q2, and the whole point is to get it well-regulated.....
I was wondering the same thing. it looks like this diode trick is usually used with Ge transistors in the textbooks.culturejam wrote:Okay, so if there is fancy temperature-correcting biasing going on, then......why? Why would that be a problem with silicon transistors?
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- mictester
- Old Solderhand
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You're right. The "Substrate" pin needs to be grounded. If it isn't, you risk destroying the IC.ibodog2 wrote: What's that "substrate" label on pin 13 mean?
Incidentally, the pin 1 - 5 transistor pair with the common emitters are really good for a "Superfuzz".
"Why is it humming?" "Because it doesn't know the words!"