Blackmarket FX - Overdrive ( CJOD Clone ) [ goop-alarm ]

Post by **whammy** » 06 Mar 2008, 23:42

Hi all – After a major de-gooping session last night, the CJOD saga might be put to rest by this hopefully.

I’ve always suspected the CJOD was a TS variant – but, like most, I wanted to try one and see what all the fuss was about.

When the Blackmarket clone went on sale, I noticed a couple of things:-
1. At least 2 long term CJOD users said they had done a back to back compare and couldn’t hear ANY difference.
2. Some of the TGP CJOD’s began hitting the market as people bought the lower cost option and then quit the CJOD while they could still get ridiculous money for them….
Plus there were a couple of youtube vids comparing the pedals, and they sounded the same on those as well..

It seemed that the guy from Blackmarket had indeed cloned the CJOD - so… I decided to bite the bullet and get one to see what the fuss was all about.

As soon as I plugged the thing in I knew it was a Tubescreamer.
It wasn’t even that good of a TS, and after playing it for about 10 minutes, I decided to pull it apart and prove it was what I was hearing… an average sounding TS.

It took a bit of work… the board was heavily gooped on both sides, but under all the crap was… you guessed it… a TS with Landgraff mods.
Nothing else !
No tricks.
Nothing new.
Just another Tubescreamer.

Now I know there’ll be some people who just won’t admit that they were fooled by a pretty paint job and a load of hype, and I know we’ll hear all the BS stories about how there might have been more than one circuit, and how the Blackmarket pedal might not be the same as a CJOD…. But the fact is that the DIY community knew all along what was going on here.
It’s the cork sniffers who’ve made fools of themselves.
All the wanking on about the unique attack, the sustain, the note bloom.
How it didn’t sound anything like a TS. Haha… fools.
If people would just use their ears, and be honest with themselves.

No wonder Clay was embarrassed about all the hype the CJOD generated.
A plain vanilla TS with Landy mods that was made out to be the greatest pedal in the world… and sold for $1500. Ridiculous.
I was going to do a schematic of this, but ironically there was no need as Clay Jones had already done it 4 years ago - It's called The Grand Laff Dynamic Overhype !!

Pics to follow.

madbean · Post by **madbean** » 07 Mar 2008, 00:15

Well, now that's settled.

bajaman · Post by **bajaman** » 07 Mar 2008, 00:40

good work Whammy
AG was right all along 0- I wonder who this BMOD chap is though =- it couldn't possibly be Clay Jones could it

bajaman

soulsonic · Post by **soulsonic** » 07 Mar 2008, 00:57

Good detective work, Whammy. It seems your investment was worthwhile? I'm glad someone was willing to make this sacrifice for the community.

Awaiting pics.

Post by **whammy** » 07 Mar 2008, 01:10

soulsonic wrote:Good detective work, Whammy. It seems your investment was worthwhile? I'm glad someone was willing to make this sacrifice for the community.

Awaiting pics.

Thanks Bajaman and soulsonic...

Yeah, it had to be done.
This saga has been playing out too long.

The board was messed up in the de-gooping, but I'll just build a decent sounding TS circuit and re-build the thing using the hardware and box - so not all is lost.

I'm still shaking my head when I think of the descriptions of the CJOD from all the 'sniffers who claim they've got "Golden Ears".

Angle Loss · Post by **Angle Loss** » 07 Mar 2008, 01:20

Cool, look forward to the pics! btw, was there any particular circuit changes in value? What was the clipping setup?

Post by **whammy** » 07 Mar 2008, 01:28

Angle Loss wrote:Cool, look forward to the pics! btw, was there any particular circuit changes in value? What was the clipping setup?

I was really expecting SOMETHING that would make it different... but really nothing.
Clipping is symmetrical - 2 red LED's... ala Landgraff Marshall mode.
Opamp is a Burr Brown OPA2134.

soulsonic · Post by **soulsonic** » 07 Mar 2008, 01:33

whammy wrote: I'm still shaking my head when I think of the descriptions of the CJOD from all the 'sniffers who claim they've got "Golden Ears".

I don't think most of those guys have real "Golden Ears" at all. I don't claim to, but I DO have highly-trained ears that have come from years of critical listening and recording. Alot of those guys who believe they need to have a specific box to get a certain sound usually don't understand their gear well enough to be able to twist the knobs right to get the sound from what they already own. I was playing with my straight-stock Dano Daddy-O pedal and with a couple knob twists I was able to easily cop all those great overdrive sounds that people drool over. It's 90% in the hands for knowing how to play it, and in the ear for knowing what to listen for. I suppose you could argue that people who purchase tweaked Tubescreamers are paying for the builder's ear for knowing what tweak sounds good, but I don't hear much of anything special in the majority of them.
It's funny; the more they tweak a Tubescreamer, the more it begins to sound like a Daddy-O.

P.S.
Daddy-O uses LEDs for clippers... just like the Gov'nor it's copied from.

mfgobbi · Post by **mfgobbi** » 07 Mar 2008, 02:33

ALRIGHT!!!! Half TGP's members must be mourning!!!!

djwackfriz · Post by **djwackfriz** » 07 Mar 2008, 02:55

posting in a legendary thread

thanks for making the sacrifice for the sake of knowledge!!!

bajaman · Post by **bajaman** » 07 Mar 2008, 02:59

Ah haaaaaa
The secret is out - the Burr Brown OPA2134 dual op amp

bajaman

Post by **whammy** » 07 Mar 2008, 03:57

Some pics.
Sorry about the quality.. my main interest at the time was getting the crap off.
The values are basically TS and Landy, including the pots... I pulled every component and tested them... waiting for "THE SECRET" to be revealed.

JimiB · Post by **JimiB** » 07 Mar 2008, 04:20

awesome and hilarious! I'm glad I cashed out when I did. It was a great pedal (hey I like toobscreamers thru fenders

but I liked paying my taxes with it.

soulsonic · Post by **soulsonic** » 07 Mar 2008, 05:47

Hmmm.... a printed circuit board. I seem to recall someone mentioning that Clay had boards made and never got a chance to use them because of his deals falling apart.

But who cares anyway, now we know what it is and hopefully everyone can get over it and get on with their lives. Great job Whammy!
Or should I say, "Great job, ....!"?
?
?
?

Deaj · Post by **Deaj** » 07 Mar 2008, 05:53

I'd done some messing around with the L'DO circuit a couple of weeks ago trying to get out of it what I remember about the CJOD and came away less than convinced that the CJOD was a L'DO clone. After reading this thread and seeing the posted pics of the degooped BMOD I opened up my L'DO clone, swapped the 3mm red LED's for 5mm's, and popped in a Burr Brown OPA2134PA. That did the trick. I sold the CJOD more than a year ago and so it's been a while since I last played one. But from what I remember of it, and listening to some recordings I'd made using the CJOD, this is it. So it looks like I paid $220 for a Landgraff DO clone with a different dual op-amp and no clipping switch. What's got me grinning, though, is that I sold a Landgraff DO clone with a different dual op-amp and no clipping switch for $1,200!?!

Thanks Whammy! Very much appreciated!

analogguru · Post by **analogguru** » 07 Mar 2008, 05:54

Thanks for all.....

This helps me to save a lot of time, when I don´t need to explain cork sniffers over and over again the things that I claimed and proved several month´s ago:

that the CJOD is nothing else than a clone of the Landgraff tubescreamer-derivate.

analoguru

Donnerbox · Post by **Donnerbox** » 07 Mar 2008, 06:17

analogguru · Post by **analogguru** » 07 Mar 2008, 06:53

One little "difference" to the schematic above:

The transistors are 2N 5088

analogguru

Post by **whammy** » 07 Mar 2008, 07:11

analogguru wrote:One little "difference" to the schematic above:

The transistors are 2N 5088

analogguru

Actually they're BC546B's AG.

For the TGP (and other forum) lurkers... no, it won't affect the sound - it's just the Buffers - so no need to go running back saying "the parts are different to a Landgraff - really, it's UNIQUE".

Good call on this in the past BTW AG.
I think the reason it was so hard to believe was just because of all the claims that owners had made.
A lesson there... never trust the opinion of a 'sniffer when they're in the presence of a pretty paint job.

analogguru · Post by **analogguru** » 07 Mar 2008, 07:29

Whammy wrote:Actually they're BC546B's AG.

For the TGP (and other forum) lurkers... no, it won't affect the sound - it's just the Buffers - so no need to go running back saying "the parts are different to a Landgraff - really, it's UNIQUE".

Oh... Oh... Oh....
So the BlackmarketFX OD is not a 100% clone of the CJOD,

cause Clay said himself:

CS Jones wrote on January 09, 2006, 04:23:52 AM at diystompboxes.com in: „Need help bypassing 4013/4053 on a Dano Tuna Melt“:

I change the 1st transistor from a 2SC1815 to a 2N5088 simply because it's easier for me to remember the pinout on that one since it's pretty much the only one I ever use anymore and I probably won't screw it up.

Whammy wrote: Good call on this in the past BTW AG.
I think the reason it was so hard to believe was just because of all the claims that owners had made.

A lesson there... never trust the opinion of a 'sniffer when they're in the presence of a pretty paint job.

Another lesson:
goop is only used to hide that in reality there is nothing to hide.

For this reason: NEVER BUY A GOOPED PEDAL !!!
(....except for the purpose of degooping it...)

analogguru