Schumann PLL  [traced]

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John Lyons
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Post by John Lyons »

Not to stir the pot but I'd love to know what the Dimehead tweaks are. :wink:
Anyone figure it out?

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Post by digi2t »

OK... I'm gonna poke up the fires here a bit.

I've been working on and off on the arpeggiator angle between other projects, and with a good break through this week, I can say that I'm 90% there. I've done some tests, and right now I'm waiting for a PCB to arrive.

It will be a selectable 10 step sequencer (1 to 10 steps), with each step having the capacity to be switched in or out of the sequence. Example; one will have the capacity to select, say 8 steps, but skip however many steps they wish within those 8 steps. Each steps tone will be adjustable as well. This should give enough capability to create some pretty creative arpeggio effects. With each step being tunable, it should resemble the pseudo-sample and hold effect that the Infinitphase can pull off in Step mode.

Depending on the power requirements, it should be a plug and play unit to the PLL, which means that existing PLL's will require some very minor mods. If for some reason the PLL cannot provide the power to run the arpeggiator, then a separate power source (Boss 9vdc) will be required. Either way, the existing PLL circuitry will require some additional wiring. It will only be a difference of +/- two wires at the end of the day. Hopefully, the PnP angle will work fine, which from what I've deduced from the original PLL, might be what John Schumann had in mind.

What's kind of neat about the arpeggiator is that the PLL may now be used as a stand alone instrument as well. Like the Drone function, one can blend the repeating arpeggios with the guitar signal, or simply play them on their own.

More news in a couple of weeks.
No matter how many times I cut it, it`s STILL too short!

https://www.deadendfx.com/

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Post by digi2t »

OK... the update is here.

The Schumann PLL Arpeggiator( :?: ).

In case you forgot, the original units had a 5 pin MIDI jack installed on them, labelled "Arpeggiator".

Image

There was nothing connected to these jacks inside the units, yet, it really intrigued me. It may have been in the works, with the option to add it later, or not, who knows. I decided it was worth investigating.

I don't know if it's what Mr. Schumann had envisioned, but here's my bend on it. Armed with a dangerous amount of information, I concocted this little beasty;

Image

Image

Nothing special. Just a 10 step sequencer that uses a 555 timer, and a 4017 for the sequencer. This PCB also has a slot for a 4046, which I'm not using, since I'm sending the VCO signal from the 4017 to the PLL's 4046. Actually, you can even use one of those Nightfire LED chaser kits to build around. It's a bit more work, between a vero and this board, but definitely do-able.

The only thing that's not up to snuff right now, is the sequence reset angle. I realized that I didn't have the right momentary switch (set of poles short), so I can't have the sequence reset itself to 1 when on standby. The switch is ordered though, and I'll be adding a toggle selector as well for "Reset" or "Free run" capability.

My biggest beef is the board, and a new board should be designed for this application. One with better (more) spacing, and minus the 4046 chip slot. Apart that, the basic idea of the board is cool.

Anywho, this is my take, and I'm stickin' to it. It's a fun little add-on, and being powered by the PLL, it's Plug 'n Play. Lots of interactivity available with the Lag, Response, and Loop Track pots. The Multiply and Divide selectors also play a role in defining the sound, so lots of knob twiddling options available.

Of course, the customary video...

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm4EBMC3 ... e=youtu.be[/youtube]
No matter how many times I cut it, it`s STILL too short!

https://www.deadendfx.com/

GodSaveMetal
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Post by GodSaveMetal »

digi2t wrote:OK... the update is here.

The Schumann PLL Arpeggiator( :?: ).

In case you forgot, the original units had a 5 pin MIDI jack installed on them, labelled "Arpeggiator".

[ Image ]

There was nothing connected to these jacks inside the units, yet, it really intrigued me. It may have been in the works, with the option to add it later, or not, who knows. I decided it was worth investigating.

I don't know if it's what Mr. Schumann had envisioned, but here's my bend on it. Armed with a dangerous amount of information, I concocted this little beasty;

[ Image ]

[ Image ]

Nothing special. Just a 10 step sequencer that uses a 555 timer, and a 4017 for the sequencer. This PCB also has a slot for a 4046, which I'm not using, since I'm sending the VCO signal from the 4017 to the PLL's 4046. Actually, you can even use one of those Nightfire LED chaser kits to build around. It's a bit more work, between a vero and this board, but definitely do-able.

The only thing that's not up to snuff right now, is the sequence reset angle. I realized that I didn't have the right momentary switch (set of poles short), so I can't have the sequence reset itself to 1 when on standby. The switch is ordered though, and I'll be adding a toggle selector as well for "Reset" or "Free run" capability.

My biggest beef is the board, and a new board should be designed for this application. One with better (more) spacing, and minus the 4046 chip slot. Apart that, the basic idea of the board is cool.

Anywho, this is my take, and I'm stickin' to it. It's a fun little add-on, and being powered by the PLL, it's Plug 'n Play. Lots of interactivity available with the Lag, Response, and Loop Track pots. The Multiply and Divide selectors also play a role in defining the sound, so lots of knob twiddling options available.

Of course, the customary video...

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm4EBMC3 ... e=youtu.be[/youtube]
Please man 8) THE PCB and LAY of the BEAST!!!!!!!!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

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Post by Govmnt_Lacky »

GodSaveMetal wrote:
digi2t wrote:OK... the update is here.
Please man 8) THE PCB and LAY of the BEAST!!!!!!!!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

Maybe try contacting AmpBlaster..... he might be able to get you one.... uhhhh.....wait...... ermmmm :blackeye :secret: :whappen:

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Post by LM393 »

Seriously? This is most impressive. :applause:

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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

digi2t wrote:OK... the update is here.

The Schumann PLL Arpeggiator( :?: ).

In case you forgot, the original units had a 5 pin MIDI jack installed on them, labelled "Arpeggiator".
Thanks for the updates. Do yourself a favour (and the rest of the world) and stop thinking of a DIN5 connector as being MIDI. It's a 5-pole connectpor that happened to be chosen for midi. It was originally designed and extensively used as an audio connector. Probably the only reason it was adopted after that for Midi is that the world moved on to cinch connectors leaving excessive warehouse inventories of DIN plugs for the grab.

The 13 pin plug used for Roland GK-type pickups was earlier known as the connector for Atari monitors. After which the world changed over to PC's en masse.
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

http://www.dirk-hendrik.com

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Post by Govmnt_Lacky »

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:
digi2t wrote:OK... the update is here.

The Schumann PLL Arpeggiator( :?: ).

In case you forgot, the original units had a 5 pin MIDI jack installed on them, labelled "Arpeggiator".
Thanks for the updates. Do yourself a favour (and the rest of the world) and stop thinking of a DIN5 connector as being MIDI. It's a 5-pole connectpor that happened to be chosen for midi. It was originally designed and extensively used as an audio connector. Probably the only reason it was adopted after that for Midi is that the world moved on to cinch connectors leaving excessive warehouse inventories of DIN plugs for the grab.

The 13 pin plug used for Roland GK-type pickups was earlier known as the connector for Atari monitors. After which the world changed over to PC's en masse.
Dude.... there is absolutely NOTHING in this post of value to add to this thread.

Not trying to bash but, was this really necessary? I mean.... it's not like digi2t hasn't contributed anything :slap:

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Post by digi2t »

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:
digi2t wrote:OK... the update is here.

The Schumann PLL Arpeggiator( :?: ).

In case you forgot, the original units had a 5 pin MIDI jack installed on them, labelled "Arpeggiator".
Thanks for the updates. Do yourself a favour (and the rest of the world) and stop thinking of a DIN5 connector as being MIDI. It's a 5-pole connectpor that happened to be chosen for midi. It was originally designed and extensively used as an audio connector. Probably the only reason it was adopted after that for Midi is that the world moved on to cinch connectors leaving excessive warehouse inventories of DIN plugs for the grab.

The 13 pin plug used for Roland GK-type pickups was earlier known as the connector for Atari monitors. After which the world changed over to PC's en masse.
Dirk... really man? Slow day, huh?

That`s OK. :roll:
No matter how many times I cut it, it`s STILL too short!

https://www.deadendfx.com/

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Dirk_Hendrik
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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

Ever tried to explain a happy guitarist that his newly aquired footcontroller could not be used with that 70's box with a "midi connector" Govmnt_Lacky ? Aparently not or you'd get the gist and the text could have been yours :roll:

Did I say anything negative about Digits contributions? Not really either.
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

http://www.dirk-hendrik.com

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Post by Govmnt_Lacky »

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Ever tried to explain a happy guitarist that his newly aquired footcontroller could not be used with that 70's box with a "midi connector" Govmnt_Lacky ? Aparently not or you'd get the gist and the text could have been yours :roll:

Did I say anything negative about Digits contributions? Not really either.
I am just saying Dirk...

I didn't see anything from digi2t saying that he plans to mass produce this build and sell it on the open market :slap:

Its a huge contribution and it just seemed to me that your comment was a knock on his effort. No one is saying that changes DONT need to be made. Just that this build works for HIM and if you want to build it so you do not have to "explain" to the guitarist.... then just do the mod OR perhaps post it on here without the sarcasm.

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Post by Dirk_Hendrik »

So, careful with interpretation of what someone else writes

I didn't see anything from digi2t saying that he plans to mass produce this build and sell it on the open market :slap:

Nor did that thought that was his intention at any moment even cross my mind.

Its a huge contribution and it just seemed to me that your comment was a knock on his effort.
Where? If a comment in a thread does not say wow it's a knock on the effort?

No one is saying that changes DONT need to be made. Just that this build works for HIM and if you want to build it so you do not have to "explain" to the guitarist....
What I had in mind and was referring to was the Youtube vid: "I've been intrigued by the fact there's a 5-pin midi jack"

post it on here without the sarcasm
Where do you read sarcasm? I certainly did not intend so and definitely not in the Midi jack part.


But in essence, great project (And yes, I do mean that) and m'r Lacky, get off your high horse please. Yesterday I wondered if I wrote something that bad. Your last response just told me you started punching letters on a keayboard after poor reading.

Further discussion? PM please, let's not derail this thread any further.
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

http://www.dirk-hendrik.com

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Post by Beedoola »

that is awesome x 10000000000

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Post by flood »

ignoring the last few absolutely inconsequential posts since the epic one, i just wanna say TAKE MY MONEY :applause:

seriously, boards for sale anytime?
In the interest of full disclosure, I am Animal Factory Amplification.

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Post by remork »

just in time to maybe be too late to stir up an old thread:

@Digi2t
i'm thinking 555 clocking a Baby 10?
running CV out to the 4046's pin #9, thus determining the VCO's frequency (as seen in the Marston's circuits pdf)?

if so - have you considered a 'glide' or portamento option? might be a nice add-on..
check page 3 here..

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Post by digi2t »

remork wrote:just in time to maybe be too late to stir up an old thread:

@Digi2t
i'm thinking 555 clocking a Baby 10?
running CV out to the 4046's pin #9, thus determining the VCO's frequency (as seen in the Marston's circuits pdf)?
Ezer's 10 step is essentially the same thing. 555 timer to 4017, outputting to the PLL. 6 of one, half dozen of the other. That was my initial build.
remork wrote:just in time to maybe be too late to stir up an old thread:
if so - have you considered a 'glide' or portamento option? might be a nice add-on..
check page 3 here..
No need to consider now. I'm now using an EHX 8 Step instead, which offers that option, among many others. Reply #573, link below (includes video at end of post);

https://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/i ... #msg946889

For the price of an 8 Step, even including the required mod to it, building something similar is a moot point IMHO. The 8 Step does plenty to keep the PLL interesting. Not to mention that you can save sequences. Mega bonus points there.
No matter how many times I cut it, it`s STILL too short!

https://www.deadendfx.com/

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Post by remork »

alright, nice one!

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Post by velouriafx »

Good evening. I built the vero version of this pedal and it worked perfectly. It really is a noisy machine.
However, I did not find the 2M pot and used a 1M pot instead. Today I had the idea to make a pot of 2M using 1 dual gang pot in series. It would be possible? What would the connections look like? Thank you.

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Post by digi2t »

2M pots are pretty easy to find. Smallbear stocks them, as well as many vendors on Ebay.
No matter how many times I cut it, it`s STILL too short!

https://www.deadendfx.com/

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Post by marshmellow »

Latest post on Zeptobars: https://zeptobars.com/en/read/Ti-CD4046 ... -VCO-zener

Now that's a proper PLL gutshot :lol:.

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