Amptweaker - Tight Metal  [traced]

General documentation, gut shot, schematic links, ongoing circuit tracing, deep thoughts ... all about boutique stompboxes.
Locked
User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

bajaman wrote:
TM schem 3f.png
tight metal -3f.sch
slight update to schematic - tight pot is now wired the right way around :wink:
tight and gain pots now wired as on the pcb
general tidy up :)
cheers
bajaman
I was curious about that... :hmmm:

User avatar
jymaze
Resistor Ronker
Information
Posts: 374
Joined: 06 Mar 2011, 22:19
Has thanked: 86 times
Been thanked: 169 times

Post by jymaze »

Actually I don't like to let one leg of my pots floating and I always tie is to the wiper as a shortcut.

If you leave it untied it is a high impedance floating point, or like some people call it, an antenna!

User avatar
The G
Resistor Ronker
Information
Posts: 447
Joined: 21 Jun 2009, 11:43
Location: Bucharest, Romania
Has thanked: 224 times
Been thanked: 188 times

Post by The G »

Bajaman, I like your PCBs so much I could frame them and put them on the wall. This is what gets out of Sprint? Awesome.

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

ggedamed wrote:Bajaman, I like your PCBs so much I could frame them and put them on the wall. This is what gets out of Sprint? Awesome.

Sprint is EASY!!! If I can use it then you know it's easy to use cause I ain't exactly the sharpest tool in the shed... :roll:

And yes, baja's PCB's are masterpieces :wink:

User avatar
azrael
Cap Cooler
Information
Posts: 563
Joined: 02 Jun 2009, 14:07
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 87 times

Post by azrael »

Here's my single sided layout. Tried to keep the pots close to edge for easy wiring. Couldn't be avoided with the Volume and Tone Pots, though. :(
Image

I'll work on a double sided layout later, should get a bit smaller. This will fit in a 1590BB.

I posted my schematic, too, because there are a few changes. Flipped some opamps around, because it made it easier to layout. Also added another 100n decoupling cap.
Attachments
tight metalschem.pdf
schematic
(31.69 KiB) Downloaded 335 times
tight metal.pdf
PCB transfer
(37.75 KiB) Downloaded 284 times

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

I discovered a minor error in my PCB layout (the wiring to the output socket was wrong - there was no track from the footswitch return pad to the output socket :oops: ).
So - here are the revised files - I called them FREESTOMPBOXES FIRM STEEL rev 2 to avoid any copyright infringement.
Sorry for any inconvenience caused - please delete the original files and use these ones :wink:
Freestompboxes Firm Steel composite rev 2.BMP
Freestompboxes Firm Steel composite rev 2.BMP (1.73 MiB) Viewed 1148 times
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview Xray rev 2.BMP
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview Xray rev 2.BMP (1.73 MiB) Viewed 1148 times
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview top side rev 2.BMP
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview top side rev 2.BMP (1.73 MiB) Viewed 1148 times
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview bottom side rev 2.BMP
Freestompboxes Firm Steel photoview bottom side rev 2.BMP (1.73 MiB) Viewed 1148 times
Cheers
bajaman
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

These look like the slide switches perhaps :?:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SW21-20pcs-Min ... 51ada2c24f
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

bajaman wrote:These look like the slide switches perhaps :?:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SW21-20pcs-Min ... 51ada2c24f

The switches are the only thing I think is cheap about this pedal... Not that they are "cheap" switches but they don't feel like they would be good for somebody who flips switches a lot... might fail sooner than a toggle.

Also, keep in mind that you will have to find a deep box or get creative if you are going to have board mounted pots, switches etc..

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

Here are the bitmap images for the FREESTOMPBOXES FIRM STEEL rev 2 PCB :wink:
freestompboxes firm steel rev 2 bmp images.rar
(233.23 KiB) Downloaded 193 times
Cheers
bajaman
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
jymaze
Resistor Ronker
Information
Posts: 374
Joined: 06 Mar 2011, 22:19
Has thanked: 86 times
Been thanked: 169 times

Post by jymaze »

I will try to make a one layer no frills layout too. I don't care about the LED's, or the effect loop, and I think the PSU is very overkill, there are also a couple places where some things can be optimized.

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

jymaze wrote:I will try to make a one layer no frills layout too. I don't care about the LED's, or the effect loop, and I think the PSU is very overkill, there are also a couple places where some things can be optimized.
That will be a rare treat! :D I have never seen you make a layout...

I am surprised that IvIark has not worked up a vero yet!?

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

I am surprised that IvIark has not worked up a vero yet!?
me too :wink: :D
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
azrael
Cap Cooler
Information
Posts: 563
Joined: 02 Jun 2009, 14:07
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 87 times

Post by azrael »

I think opamp circuits are always the hardest to put on Vero, haha. I can understand if a layout never gets made, there's a lot going on here, especially with the redundant voltage references.

User avatar
The G
Resistor Ronker
Information
Posts: 447
Joined: 21 Jun 2009, 11:43
Location: Bucharest, Romania
Has thanked: 224 times
Been thanked: 188 times

Post by The G »

Jim, did you formed an opinion about Tight Metal? Especially versus the Black Forest or Engl MOSFET simulation.
I breadboarded it, but it was not enough time to nitpick it. It's still on the breadboard, so I'll look into it when time allows.

My first impression - you'll notice that I'm a lousy player even for bedroom, besides there's a high probability of breadboarding errors - is OK, a little too much sponginess for my taste. Relistening the Youtube clips I get the same feeling. And I definitely don't like the way noise gate cuts the signal - again I can here it on Youtube. I noticed some of the players are using an external noise gate in the loop. I also noticed no one used TIGHT beyond 35%. Right now I believe Black Forest sounds and feels way better, but I only tried at bedroom level.

I'll check the other voltages (the two references are close to 5.25V and 5.9V as calculated), then I'll try TLC2622 (I'm not having much hope with this as I didn't like the Sansamp clipping also) and then some op amps that behave better on clipping. Just for the sake of the DIYness.

Anyway, here is the clip (the GAIN/GATE is an A1M, and the MID is hard-wired in the THRASH position, most of the time is the bridge humbucker into the breadboard, then into a TDA7294 amp, recorded with a photo camera):


LATER EDIT:
azrael wrote:[...] there's a lot going on here, especially with the redundant voltage references.
I think the redundant voltage references are there only for laying-out purposes.

Here's a simplified-for-my-lazy-brain schematic I used for breadboarding (wrong values on references, but you get the idea):
Tight Metal_simplified_mono.png
EVEN LATER EDIT:
It just crossed my mind to use two LM317L as variable regulators for references.

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

Here's a simplified-for-my-lazy-brain schematic I used for breadboarding
It may help if you bypass the 150k resistor with a 22uf electro, if you use this simplified bias scheme :wink:
cheers
bajaman
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

ggedamed wrote:Jim, did you formed an opinion about Tight Metal? Especially versus the Black Forest or Engl MOSFET simulation.
I breadboarded it, but it was not enough time to nitpick it. It's still on the breadboard, so I'll look into it when time allows.

My first impression - you'll notice that I'm a lousy player even for bedroom, besides there's a high probability of breadboarding errors - is OK, a little too much sponginess for my taste. Relistening the Youtube clips I get the same feeling. And I definitely don't like the way noise gate cuts the signal - again I can here it on Youtube. I noticed some of the players are using an external noise gate in the loop. I also noticed no one used TIGHT beyond 35%. Right now I believe Black Forest sounds and feels way better, but I only tried at bedroom level.

I'll check the other voltages (the two references are close to 5.25V and 5.9V as calculated), then I'll try TLC2622 (I'm not having much hope with this as I didn't like the Sansamp clipping also) and then some op amps that behave better on clipping. Just for the sake of the DIYness.

Anyway, here is the clip (the GAIN/GATE is an A1M, and the MID is hard-wired in the THRASH position, most of the time is the bridge humbucker into the breadboard, then into a TDA7294 amp, recorded with a photo camera):


LATER EDIT:
azrael wrote:[...] there's a lot going on here, especially with the redundant voltage references.
I think the redundant voltage references are there only for laying-out purposes.

Here's a simplified-for-my-lazy-brain schematic I used for breadboarding (wrong values on references, but you get the idea):
Tight Metal_simplified_mono.png
EVEN LATER EDIT:
It just crossed my mind to use two LM317L as variable regulators for references.
Sponginess? I don't hear it?? Sounds tight as a gnat's twat to me :lol: I like mine but it is the "real pedal" as I have not had enough time to build a clone yet... The real pedal has sh!t loads of gain!! Sounds really good in your clip! It's really smooth and tight to me, not as noisy and erratic as the Engl or BF. Has a lot of mid range even in the thrash setting which I like. I am not a big fan of opamp based distortions or high gain preamps but this one doesn't feel or sound like opamp to me... I need to put my original back together and play it more and build one asap...! I personally like to be able to control the gate independently so I will probably not use a dual gang pot. I only used very little gate if I use it at all.. I use it mostly for chuggin rhythm for stops and lower background noise.

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

the missing bypass capacitor is probably what is causing the sponginess :hmmm:
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

Here's another single sided... Can you guys see anything wrong with it? Goes along with bajaman's schematic.
Attachments
TM1.PNG
TM2.PNG

User avatar
bajaman
Old Solderhand
Information
Posts: 4385
Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 21:18
Location: New Brighton, Christchurch, NZ
Has thanked: 476 times
Been thanked: 1736 times

Post by bajaman »

D5 floating on top layout drawing :wink:
be kind to all animals - especially human beings

User avatar
J0K3RX
Degoop Doctor
Information
Posts: 1048
Joined: 29 Jun 2011, 01:25
Location: US Florida
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Post by J0K3RX »

bajaman wrote:D5 floating on top layout drawing :wink:
yup :roll: noticed that right after I posted it.. fixed, thanks! Anything else that catches your eye? Asking because I figure you and jymaze pretty much know this like the back of your hands by now... :D

Locked