Sarno Earth Drive

[GratefulEight]

1N60 or 1N60P are going to be the diodes then most likely; I have some 1N60 ones that also measure right in that range (the 1N60P ones I tried to order ended up being the silicon Schottky variety).

Timmy schem for cross reference for anyone else (like me) that would have to look it up to know what the structure looks like.

[GratefulEight]

So essentially Paul Cochrane's Timmy, minus the bass pot but with half ge diodes?

In fact the same circuit structure, then what's the point of gooping components.
The circuit copier fears nothing more than that his circuit is copied.

If you notice in the pictures, not only is the IC sanded and the hot-glue style goop all over the diodes, there was black spray paint applied too.


But I will say this for him: whatever amount of copying and component-swap tinkering Brad may have done in getting there, the end product does reliably produce a very nice drive sound.

[GratefulEight]

Also...it appears that there may be a PCB forthcoming from one of the usual pedal sites for this circuit in the near-ish future, so any of you guys who would rather buy a board to populate than put together a perf or vero layout and build from scratch can keep an eye out for that.

[Nocentelli]

....whatever amount of copying and component-swap tinkering Brad may have done in getting there, the end product does reliably produce a very nice drive sound.

Yes, but this is because he recycled, with minimal and inconsequential changes, a relatively original design that Paul Cochrane came up with in the early '90s and has been making by hand since then.... Brad couldn't really go wrong. Same as Lovepedal Sean's Amp 11 and Danelectro's Transparent OD, pretty unethical

[GratefulEight]

....whatever amount of copying and component-swap tinkering Brad may have done in getting there, the end product does reliably produce a very nice drive sound.

Yes, but this is because he recycled, with minimal and inconsequential changes, a relatively original design that Paul Cochrane came up with in the early '90s and has been making by hand since then.... Brad couldn't really go wrong. Same as Lovepedal Sean's Amp 11 and Danelectro's Transparent OD, pretty unethical

It seems that unethical is a bit relative in the world of analog guitar circuits, considering here we are deconstructing Brad's "work" without knowing beforehand it's a copy to...copy it? Not to turn around and sell Paul's design as our own "Boutique" thing like Brad has done, but it's not like Paul is earning royalties on what we put together either.

To be clear I'm not disagreeing with you, or defending Brad here--just making an observation about the relatively commonplace nature of plagiarism in this space and saying that I like the noises the ED makes. Maybe I should find some contact info for Paul and thank him for his contribution...seems appropriate.

What would you say the solution is? I mean, short of convincing every person/company tweaking an existing circuit and passing it off as their own boutique product to knock it off?

[Manfred]

I made this layout for it:

Ready-to-print PDF-files:

EarthDriveLayoutComponentSide.pdf

(9.68 KiB) Downloaded 61 times

EarthDriveLayoutSolderSide.pdf

(2.91 KiB) Downloaded 64 times

SprintLayout6.0 file:

EarthDriveLayout.zip

(11.85 KiB) Downloaded 52 times

[GratefulEight]

I made this layout for it:
EarthDriveLayout.JPG
Ready-to-print PDF-files:
EarthDriveLayoutComponentSide.pdf
EarthDriveLayoutSolderSide.pdf
SprintLayout6.0 file:
EarthDriveLayout.zip

Very nice--thanks, Manfred!

[Nocentelli]

It seems that unethical is a bit relative in the world of analog guitar circuits....

I'd agree it is relative, or more like it is a spectrum:

Lovepedal is at one end, with Sean insisting the Amp 11 was entirely his own design and that he had never seen the Timmy schematic despite it being pretty obviously based on Paul's pedal; Wampler, Catalinbread, Earthquaker etc at the other end, being pretty upfront about exactly what their designs are based on if they share some heritage.

This puts the Earth drive in the middle: The ad copy states "The Earth Drive is the ultimate transparent overdrive pedal designed to retain the natural character of your instrument" but oops, omits to mention that it was designed by someone else. Reading that ad, most would assume it implied "designed by Sarno".

.....it's not like Paul is earning royalties on what we put together either.

This isn't the point: It's not about Paul's hypothetical "lost sales" from individual diy-ers making their own clone, or even knocking out a copy for a friend for the cost of parts who doesn't want to/can't afford a Timmy, it's about a commercial pedal brand passing off a pedal as their own when it is not really anything other than a tweaked version of a relatively original design made by a sole builder.

What would you say the solution is? I mean, short of convincing every person/company tweaking an existing circuit and passing it off as their own boutique product to knock it off?

There isn't a "solution" as such, but freestompboxes.org's very existence and mission to trace and document every pedal ever made is part of the ongoing work of exposing these sort of things, informing people about what is inside pedals and occasionally demystifying / countering the hype.

[GratefulEight]

Well said on all points. I guess I'm more wishing there were a solution, that people/companies/whomever would decide on their own to avoid the hype/deception/bullshit without having to be called out over it, than I am expecting there to actually be one. Either way, I agree with what you're saying.

[CheapPedalCollector]

I've wanted a Timmy for a long time, like Analog Man he only makes them in small batches and they are constantly out of stock or the waiting list is years. I'm also not paying $250-$800 for under 50 bucks in parts that I can bin myself if needed. He's not losing any sales when the items are unavailable imo. I could buy an MXR one, but I don't want a mini pedal with side jacks, so I'll just make my own, but I won't sell them. People do come up with similar designs at the same time or also far apart, without knowledge of the other. Not saying that's the case here, but it's mostly just whinging and whining about something that in the end makes no difference other than moral objectivity.

Meanwhile I have 3 Pure Sky's and enjoy them just fine until I can either buy an actual Timmy for it's intended price, or just build one myself with jacks on top.

[Nocentelli]

100% agree with all the rest of this post, but ...

People do come up with similar designs at the same time or also far apart, without knowledge of the other. Not saying that's the case here....

...the fact that the ICs are sanded and the board gooped and spray painted makes this look very much like an attempt to hide the true origins of the "design" and somehow makes it worse.

[CheapPedalCollector]

100% agree with all the rest of this post, but ...

People do come up with similar designs at the same time or also far apart, without knowledge of the other. Not saying that's the case here....

...the fact that the ICs are sanded and the board gooped and spray painted makes this look very much like an attempt to hide the true origins of the "design" and somehow makes it worse.

This is true, its suspect for sure. Then again, I don't agree with gooping in general and if I buy a pedal and it's gooped I'll demand a refund and return it because if it breaks I can't fix it, and that's pretty lame.

[mirosol]

Yup. Trying to hide that there was an influence from somewhere else is not all that cool. I think there's been a truckload of goop discussion before. There is simply no logical reason to do it. It'll prevent or make legit repairs way harder than they need to be, etc. I've not found any positive points on goop yet. And at some point someone's going to degoop it anyway and usually (like nine point nine times out of ten) it's a circuit that's been done before, with minor tweaks, if even that.

Anyway. Here's a stripboard layout (which is quite easy to repair and mod once you've built one...). Currently unverified, but seems to be ok. (updated, added a missing cut... // updated again - changed feedback loop soothing cap to 100p per GratefulEight trace)
+m

[GratefulEight]

Yup. Trying to hide that there was an influence from somewhere else is not all that cool. I think there's been a truckload of goop discussion before. There is simply no logical reason to do it. It'll prevent or make legit repairs way harder than they need to be, etc. I've not found any positive points on goop yet. And at some point someone's going to degoop it anyway and usually (like nine point nine times out of ten) it's a circuit that's been done before, with minor tweaks, if even that.

Anyway. Here's a stripboard layout (which is quite easy to repair and mod once you've built one...). Currently unverified, but seems to be ok.
+m

Thanks for doing the vero layout! That'll make it easier for some folks to get theirs going for sure.

As a side note, PedalPCB now has a board for this circuit for sale here as well, if anybody would rather shell out $8 for a printed one. It's based on the trace I posted here and I've built one. Sounds VERY close to the EarthDrive I traced it from with a 4558 and 1N60s; not exact (probably the opAmp and diodes, as I had to use 4148s for the silicon and the opamp is a guess).