Fender 5F2-A Princeton Tweed

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 28 May 2008, 11:47

Hi all,
I have a sweet 1960 Princeton Tweed that currently has a Weber in it. I have two Weber 8" speakers, one is the alnico high dollar one, and the other is the popular replacement ceramic model. Both are 3.8 ohms.
I like the ceramic model better, but I am not that impressed with Webers in general. I've tried to like them, I just don't. I also have a '66 Deluxe Reverb that I put the suggested Weber in and I ended up with a generic Fender brand speaker, an Eminence or Utah, I think, that kills the Weber.
Anyway, do any of you have a suggestion for a great speaker for this great old amp? I like sparkle and a tight bottom end in my tone. That's the goal, anyway

This amp sounds wonderful through a 12" EVM12-L in an open back cab. I wish it would fit!!!
Thanks,
Plus

vanessa · Post by **vanessa** » 28 May 2008, 19:51

You won't believe it but the cheapo Jensen MOD 8" ($17) sounds great in there. Many people rave about it in these little champ amps.

Can I ask you to do me a favor? Can you get me the voltages off your PT secondaries? First get a voltage off your primary (house/line) voltage as a reference. I would really appreciate it. There seems to be a lot of misinformation going around about these PT's and I would like to add your findings to the archive.

Thank you!

Van

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 28 May 2008, 20:32

Sure, no problem.
Give me a day or so though, I'm swamped at work and too pooped out to do it right now.
The results I post will be voltages across new (3 year old) electrolytics, Sprague Atoms, with a healthy rectifier tube.
-Dave

vanessa · Post by **vanessa** » 28 May 2008, 21:21

premiumplus wrote:Sure, no problem.
Give me a day or so though, I'm swamped at work and too pooped out to do it right now.
The results I post will be voltages across new (3 year old) electrolytics, Sprague Atoms, with a healthy rectifier tube.
-Dave

Thank you! I'm not looking for the circuit point voltages, just the actual voltages off the power transformer itself. What your volt meter is showing as your line voltage (house) on the primary, and what your volt meter is showing for the main secondary (right before the rectifier), and the filament secondaries (heaters and rectifier). Be careful those are some high voltages.

tunghaichuan · Post by **tunghaichuan** » 28 May 2008, 22:30

vanessa wrote: Thank you! I'm not looking for the circuit point voltages, just the actual voltages off the power transformer itself. What your volt meter is showing as your line voltage (house) on the primary, and what your volt meter is showing for the main secondary (right before the rectifier), and the filament secondaries (heaters and rectifier). Be careful those are some high voltages.

I copied this from the Ampage a few years ago:

56 champ PT voltages
I have a 1956 Champ PT sitting on my desk right now. I just took some unloaded measurements with my variac tonight, and here's what I got:

110 VAC -> 240-0-240
117 -> 255-0-255
120 -> 262-0-262
123 -> 268-0-268

New info
56 Champ:
110VAC -> 240-0-240

55 Princeton:
110 -> 325-0-325

HTH,

tung

vanessa · Post by **vanessa** » 29 May 2008, 18:06

tunghaichuan wrote: I copied this from the Ampage a few years ago:

Thank you Tung. I've seen those before. I was asking Dave for his voltages from his 1960 Princeton power transformer to document and for a comparison.

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 02 Jun 2008, 21:30

Hi Vanessa,
Measured with a true RMS Fluke 87 type III DMM, I got these voltages from the 5F2A:
Voltages were measured after the amp was warmed up:
House AC: 122.8 Vac
Transformer secondaries:
Red wires, 349.3 Vac and 348.0 Vac, measured to ground.
Yellow wires, at rectifier filament connection, 5.39 Vac, measured across the tube.
Green wires, one of which is grounded and the other is at the pilot lamp, 6.9 Vac, measured to ground.
It just occurred to me that I must have missed a green wire for the 12 Vac filament connection but the amp is buttoned back up now. I'll get it if it's important to you.

Hope this helps!
-Dave

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 03 Jun 2008, 11:20

OK back to the topic...are there any other votes for the Jensen MOD speaker? I'm a classic rock and blues guy and I want a speaker that will grunt and sing a little when I push it. The Webers sound too dark for lack of a better term. I want some spank and bite, you know? Thanks everyone...
-Dave

vanessa · Post by **vanessa** » 03 Jun 2008, 18:33

premiumplus wrote:OK back to the topic...are there any other votes for the Jensen MOD speaker? I'm a classic rock and blues guy and I want a speaker that will grunt and sing a little when I push it. The Webers sound too dark for lack of a better term. I want some spank and bite, you know? Thanks everyone...
-Dave

Thank you for the voltage readings, I'll get back to you on those in a bit when I have more time.

The MOD is on the bright side with nice lows for an 8" speaker. I'm sure you'll want to break it in for a few hours on a signal generator before you start seeing that.
The MOD breaks up a later getting you a little more headroom. Heck at $17 why not try it?

http://www.tubesandmore.com/scripts/fox ... -A-MOD8-20

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 06 Jun 2008, 13:53

Thanks Van, I just pulled the trigger. As usual, a $17 purchase ended up a $80 one...

I needed a tank for my Super Reverb, a choke, some caps...I'll let you know how it sounds.
-Dave

premiumplus · Post by **premiumplus** » 13 Jun 2008, 11:34

I posted a while back about a speaker for this amp.
Vanessa suggested I try a "cheapo Jensen MOD 8" ($17)"
THANK YOU VANESSA!

I got one (with a free Fruit of the Loom quality Jensen t-shirt) and it rocks.
Great cleans, and cranked in 3.5 watt tube ragin glory, it sounds heavenly.
I have spent probably $130 in speakers for this little turd over the years looking for a great speaker. I would NEVER have believed that a little under $20 driver would sound this fine but it does. I'm going to order them for my other 3 Silverface Champs too.

If anybody is sitting on the fence wondering what speaker to buy for a Champ style amp, you know where I'm going to point you! Sheesh, for the price of the t-shirt, you get a free speaker!

-Dave

vanessa · Post by **vanessa** » 16 Jun 2008, 20:05

What a difference a speaker makes? I've seen people totally rip apart an amp doing mojo mods to get better lows/highs, tighter bass, and more headroom. An efficient speaker replacement can do the trick whether it's $1 or $200. I had a little practice amp that had a really cheap no-name home stereo type ceramic speaker in it. I thought I could get that mojo tone if I upgraded to a more expensive alnico speaker. Not. I lost the lows and overall headroom. The speaker sounded tinny and farty by comparison. I'm not saying this is always the case, but when I read about how happy people were with the Jensen MOD's in their champs/princetons it was not hard for me to believe.