Univox - Superfuzz  [schematic]

Discussion regarding early stompbox technology: 1960-1975 Please keep discussion focused and contribute what info you have...
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8mileshigh
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Post by 8mileshigh »

Hi,

Can somebody tell me where the octave trimpot would go on the schematic below. I bought a pcb board from John Lyons about 5 years ago and I'm finally ready to build this but it's been many noons since I've fired up the old soldering iron. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

http://www.univox.org/pics/schematics/superfuzz2.gif

BTW, is worth ordering the 2SC828 and 2SC539 transistors from small Bear or can I use modern day equivalents.

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Post by LucifersTrip »

8mileshigh wrote:Hi,

Can somebody tell me where the octave trimpot would go on the schematic below.
I think that would be the 10K from Q4/5 bases to ground.
http://www.univox.org/pics/schematics/superfuzz2.gif
BTW, is worth ordering the 2SC828 and 2SC539 transistors from small Bear or can I use modern day equivalents.
yes...I'd just try to keep the gains in the 150-250 range

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Post by LucifersTrip »

this is the scheme i wanted to include in the last post...with the octave trim
http://www.univox.org/pics/schematics/superfuzz.gif

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Post by 8mileshigh »

Thank you Lucifer, I built a Kay Fuzztone years ago and yes this makes sense. I think it's important to make sure these two transistors also have identical gains. My Kay circuit had a wicked octave effect and if I'm not mistaken, it's a very similar circuit to the Super Fuzz. I think it's still on my breadboard, I'll go check.

Thank you,
Chris

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Post by 8mileshigh »

LucifersTrip wrote:this is the scheme i wanted to include in the last post...with the octave trim
http://www.univox.org/pics/schematics/superfuzz.gif

Yes, I see the trim pot in this schematic, this was most excellent of you to track this down for me. High five!!!

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Post by LucifersTrip »

8mileshigh wrote:Thank you Lucifer, I built a Kay Fuzztone years ago and yes this makes sense. I think it's important to make sure these two transistors also have identical gains. My Kay circuit had a wicked octave effect and if I'm not mistaken, it's a very similar circuit to the Super Fuzz. I think it's still on my breadboard, I'll go check.

Thank you,
Chris
Kay looks like a simplified Super Fuzz w/ only has 4 transistors. 1st or 2nd stage and last stage form the Super Fuzz left off
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3045/2289 ... eb05_b.jpg

good luck with the Super Fuzz

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Post by mictester »

It's essential that the long-tailed pair transistors have virtually identical hfe for best octave generation. You also want quite low gains - that's why I always got great results when I used CA3046 arrays. You have to remember that transistors in those days tended to have relatively low hfe (by modern standards.

The germanium diodes clamp the signal level at about 200 mV p-p, which is pretty low - which is why the Superfuzz has the gain recovery stage at the end. It worsens the signal tp noise, but allows the use of the relatively soft clipping afforded by germanium. If you find that the level is too low. you can stand the germanium diodes on top of a pair of Schottky diodes (will roughly double the level) or even a pair of silicon diodes (adds 0.65 V p-p) whilst retaining the soft transition "edge" of the germanium diodes.

However, in practice, you'll be hard pressed to hear much difference (except in level) between silicon and germanium - especially in a gig situation. You might hear a marginal difference in the studio, but in most instances (particularly in a mix) they'll be inaudible. The octave generation is particularly obvious with this pedal - it's the best part of its sound - but it's a bit of a one-trick-pony to my ears!
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Post by 8mileshigh »

Does anybody know what happened to the wonderful site dedicated to the Super Fuzz over at Fortune City? That was an invaluable resource for up fuzz junkies and it seems like Fortune City is now kaput!

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Post by derringer »

Thaxt wrote:I think the 1N34A diodes - or the OA-90s - weaken this pedal's sound when they are direct to ground; the AMZ warp mod - placing a 10 K pot between diodes & ground - seems a key to getting both better volume & fuzz texture.

I've tried the stock configuration, & it does come off as way too weak...hissy & fuzzy, but (IMO) not a strong fuzz.

LED's as subs do tend to hit pretty hard, but the usual other diode subs can do wonders, & bring out the UVSF's innate, characteristic sounds.

Modding the midscoop is key too. Modding those 2 things can get you a whole 'nuther Superfuzz, meaning: in a good way.

The (overly?) scooped, meek & fizzy can become: WOW! The scoop is great for bass tho.
and that's pretty much what I did for my superfuzz build
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and it's been on my pedalboard around 3 years now, love this thing

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Post by 8mileshigh »

Thanks, I'm just about to start my build, this will help, thanks!
derringer wrote:
Thaxt wrote:I think the 1N34A diodes - or the OA-90s - weaken this pedal's sound when they are direct to ground; the AMZ warp mod - placing a 10 K pot between diodes & ground - seems a key to getting both better volume & fuzz texture.

I've tried the stock configuration, & it does come off as way too weak...hissy & fuzzy, but (IMO) not a strong fuzz.

LED's as subs do tend to hit pretty hard, but the usual other diode subs can do wonders, & bring out the UVSF's innate, characteristic sounds.

Modding the midscoop is key too. Modding those 2 things can get you a whole 'nuther Superfuzz, meaning: in a good way.

The (overly?) scooped, meek & fizzy can become: WOW! The scoop is great for bass tho.
and that's pretty much what I did for my superfuzz build

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Post by carboncomp »

HI,

Just finished a build (standard build as per OP), and it sound really good till about 2oclock where it making spiky bursts when I hit the strings?

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Post by LucifersTrip »

carboncomp wrote:HI,

Just finished a build (standard build as per OP), and it sound really good till about 2oclock where it making spiky bursts when I hit the strings?
compare your voltages to an original

C B E
Q1 6.01 .66 .117
Q2 8.88 6.01 5.41
Q3 6.23 3.27 2.72
Q4 3.1 1.7 1.11
Q5 3.1 1.67 1.11
Q6 5.75* .98 .361

*can be lower

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Post by LucifersTrip »

just thought I'd make a quick note....

I scrapped some old electronics today from the early 1970's and pulled a bunch of 2SC828's. The majority had gains from 83 to 110 and one was as high as 132.

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Post by electrosonic »

I breadboarded a superfuzz using a LM3046 - I thought this looked cool - the bottom trace is the input signal, the upper trace is the output before the diodes. The upper octave is really obvious. I did not use a trim for the octave, I just used 1% metal film resistors with no matching.

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Post by Nocentelli »

electrosonic wrote:I breadboarded a superfuzz using a LM3046 - I thought this looked cool - the bottom trace is the input signal, the upper trace is the output before the diodes. The upper octave is really obvious. I did not use a trim for the octave, I just used 1% metal film resistors with no matching
Cool, I've been planning to try this out (3046 superfuzz) every since mictester suggested it a few years back: I don't suppose you've done a schematic with the array pinouts, or did you just use the stock schematic and common sense?
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Post by electrosonic »

I actually ended up breadboarding the Ibanez standard fuzz - it is the same as the superfuzz but with a jfet input stage instead of a more complicated two transistor input.

analog guru has the schematic on his site - http://analogguru.an.ohost.de/193/schem ... rdFuzz.gif

I ended up just tying pin 13 to ground, as suggested on the datasheetd - "wasting" one transistor.

I have been thinking of ways to use that transistor, looking at voltage amplifiers that bias via a collector to base resistor and then ground the emitter. Haven't figured out anything particularly elegant yet.

Andrew.

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Post by mictester »

electrosonic wrote:
I ended up just tying pin 13 to ground, as suggested on the datasheet - "wasting" one transistor.

I have been thinking of ways to use that transistor
I used it to switch an LED, in a sort of "millennium bypass" circuit (using a FET to drive the transistor and keep the input impedance really high). I hate wasting parts of ICs!
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Post by astrobass »

Bumping because I just built one of these.

Used 2N2222As throughout. The Q4/Q6 pair were matched at hfe 196. The Q1/Q2 duo were 140ish and 200ish. Don't recall exact values. Don't care. Sounds awesome.

Pair of 1N60 diodes. Was initially hesitant, wanted to make them asymmetric by adding a second one in one direction but forced myself to just see what the stock config sounds like. SOUNDS LIKE AWESOME IS WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE.

Anyhow, not sure whether this, my Harmonic Percolator clone, or my Ge Meathead is my favourite fuzz so far, at least, on guitar. This is, despite the part count, completely worth building. I'm actually doing it for a buddy, I'm going to combine it with a Morley twin-t wah circuit and house the two in an old volume pedal enclosure, after tweaking the input/output caps and generally futzing about to get the two to play nice.

Definitely making one for myself, though.

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Post by astrobass »

Oh, forgot to mention. Didn't bother with the trim pot, as both Q4/Q5 were matched exactly. Also, didn't use electrolytic caps, used ceramic. Got a bunch off eBay in an assortment that goes up to 10 uF, so I figured let's see what it does. Sounds great with them. Might do my second version using electrolytic caps just for comparison, but I can't see it being significantly better.

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