Little VOODOO VIBE project by Kaputepalla  [documentation]

Original effects with schematics, layouts and instructions, freely contributed by members or found in publications. Cannot be used for commercial purposes without the consent of the owners of the copyright.
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bajaman
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Post by bajaman »

I'll tell you some tricks when you'll end the pcb and send to you the photos!Do you want to see the true double faced layout?
Yes please - I built one of these with your layout - still undecided though - what are the best phase shift cap values????
On this one and the original greenserve schem they are .015uf, .1uf, .047uf, .0047uf in that order
The Unicord 905 (from harpamps site) gives these values
.015uf, .22uf, .47uf, .0047uf
The Unicord 915 schem uses these values
.015uf, .22uf, 470pf, .0047uf

Can anyone verify what the correct values should be - they do not follow any particular sequence as far as I can see. RG Keen says that the Unicord 915 values are the correct values. also on the Vooddoo vibe schem, the .1uf coupling caps seem a little on the low side - they are 1uf in the Unicord schems - any thoughts on any of these points of difference :?:
bajaman

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Post by analogguru »

Some time ago I found by chance this: US. Pat. 3.418.418 assigned to D. R. Wilder on Dec. 24, 1968 (filed: May 25, 1964).
Funny, it looks very close to: ....the univibe (and clones).

So the patent states:
Lamp should be : "General Electric No. 19 Frosted"
LDR: "B-731-04-red"

...whatever this means (red: selected?). Maybe someone has an old electronics catalog or spec-sheets ?

but this would be an interesting mojo-project: 1964-Phaser with pnp-ge-trannies... back to the "vintage"-roots

or here the "Tube Univibe" in: Us. Pat. 3.257.510 assigned to M. D. Burkhard on June 21, 1966 (filed: Oct. 15, 1962)

Have a look at the interesting capacitor values for the phase shift stages, familiar ?

good luck,
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Post by alessandro »

The original voodoovibe caps sounds very god!Listen to it before to experimenting changes!Kaputepalla

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Post by Bernardduur »

+1

Mine is working like a charm; had some problems with the LDR (sunlight is bad) but now it sounds wonderful!
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Post by bajaman »

Thanks AG - but after perusing the patents, i am no better informed - the tube circuit only has three stages and none of the individual phase shift cap values are given in the solid state version except the input stage cap value.
I am still curious to know why these caps are all so different - how come there is such a difference in values for essentially the same circuit???
bajaman

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Post by analogguru »

Maybe this guts could be more helpful ?:

Shinei inside 1, Shinei inside 2

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Post by greenskull »

Bernardduur wrote:I tried it with some old LDR's I had laying around.....
doesn't work yet; debugging begins today :)

I have in the chorus mode a vibrato sound, no sound in the vibrato and tremolo

Yet!

Edit; I had the leads on the chorus / vibrato / tremolo mixed up; it works!
How do you like it? I've built a Neovibe, but still was thinking of taking this one on.

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Post by alessandro »

The leds mounted in the original (and in the little voodoovibe) must be transparent yellow type not dark painted yellow,so try to find it to obtain best results!I've mounted the same LDR miniature type i used in the easy vibe circuit and sounds amazing! 8)

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Post by bajaman »

i used 3mm hi brite transparent leds - yellow light type - they work okay - Sorry AG those gut shots do not help at all.
Does anyone know what the correct value and sequence of cap values are??
bajaman

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Post by alessandro »

Obviously every LED-LDR couple is close in a termo pipe against dust and external light!

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Post by bajaman »

Yes - it works fine, BUT, I was curious about the capacitor values - are they verified - the .047uf or 47nf capacitor seems to be wrong perhaps???
bajaman

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Post by analogguru »

Schematic values:
Univox 915: 15n, 220n, 470p, 4n7
Shinei RT-18: 4n7, 3n3, 2n2, 1n
Jax Vibrachorus: 15n, 100n?, 500p, 47n?
Companion SVC-1: 15n?, 100n?, 470p?, ???

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Post by celadine »

Jurgen Haible built a univibe clone he called 'Neptune' phaser -

http://home.debitel.net/user/jhaible/hj_neptune.html

He included sockets for those capacitors and selected them by ear. JC Maillet put in spdt switches to select different caps for each stage in a Small Stone clone, the same could be done for a univibe. detailed here:

http://www.lynx.bc.ca/~jc/pedalsSmallStone.html

p.s. - I hope these are more useful than the 4069 charge pump idea. Didn't work at all when I tried it.

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Post by Bernardduur »

I also have a Neovibe

I found the Voodoo much better; qualitywise, noisewise, soundwise. AND you get a cool tremolo (although it can't get real choppy). The sound is real Uni-vibish with a vintage touch; still, it has his own voice. Best thing: it runs on 9V!

Downside: too much controls :)
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Post by bajaman »

Thank you AG and celadine - I just solved the problem, then came inside to read your values and comments.
I suspected that the 47n in the 3rd phase shift stage of the little voodoo vibe was the incorrect value, and so I had a think about why these particular values were chosen. Grolschie was in my workshop this afternoon and I had a brainwave as to why these values and their particular order etc., after we both listened to my little voodoo vibe in it's 1790 case, and decided something was not quite right - sounded like a bad acid trip :wink: :lol:
Anyway - having read the technology of the univibe by RG Keen, in which he gives the original values, although not understanding why they were chosen, it dawned on me that, it does not matter which order the capacitors are inserted, and that this was possibly to confuse people trying to clone the univibe - who knows :?:
Okay - there are 4 phase shift stages with a different value capacitor being used in each stage. Why :?: - to give a more complex harmonic phasing sound like a rotary speaker does :!: who knows. I believe these capacitors were chosen to represent 4 distinct frequency bands of operation, and it seems reasonable that they should be evenly spaced in the frequency domain.
So - out with my logarithmic graph paper and ruler.
First - I used 470pf for the highest phase shift frequency, because several people including RG Keen stated this as one of the correct univibe values.
Second - I chose to stay with the 100n capacitor used in the little voodoo vibe for my lowest phase shift frequency - although RG Keen stated that 220n was the correct value, I noticed that one of the schematics I had previously downloaded had a suggestio to use 100n for less bass response. This was possibly Roger Mayer's chosen value in his modifications to Jimi's univibe, and why it appears in the little voodoo vibe :?:
Third - I measured with my ruler on the logarithmic frequency axis of my graph paper, and divided the linear distance between 470pf and 100nf into three even spaces. This gave approximate values for the remaining two capacitors as 2n7 and 15n. So I removed the 47n and 4n7 and replaced them with these calculated values.
How does it sound now - fantastically smooth, bubbly and a lot brighter in the top end due to the 470pf capacitor. Before the mods the vibrato made me feel like a seasick drunk and there was no way i could get an evn sounding chorus - it lurched - no matter where I set the bias, symmetry or intensity controls. Now all these controls have very usable ranges and as Roger Mayer states in his literature you should start with all these controls set in the centre of their travel and tweak to personal taste.
Now the chorus does indeed sound much more like a rotary speaker cabinet - before it sounded like a badly balanced washing machine on it's spin cycle :roll: :wink:
I don't think it makes any difference which order these capacitors are inserted, but it does make a very noticeable difference using these values compared to green fuzz's or kaputella's values which are clearly incorrect after my listening tests :wink:
If you want a lower bass response then use these values - 470pf, 3n9, 27n, and 220n. Or experiment with a wider or narrower range, just keep the linear distance between each value on a logarithmic frequency axis the same, and read off the values.
Another way to calculate values is to first decide the highest frequency capacitor and multiply it by the same amount.
For example: choose 470pf, then multiply by 8. This gives 3760pf (3n9).
Then multiply 3760pf by 8, this gives us 30080pf (30n). then finally multiply 30080pf by 8, this gives us 240640pf (240n)
So you could use 470pf, 3n9, 30n, 240n for a different but still very smooth sounding chorus effect.
Have fun
bajaman

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Post by Bernardduur »

Awesome man!

I'll try em!
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Post by greenskull »

Bernardduur wrote:I also have a Neovibe

I found the Voodoo much better; qualitywise, noisewise, soundwise. AND you get a cool tremolo (although it can't get real choppy). The sound is real Uni-vibish with a vintage touch; still, it has his own voice. Best thing: it runs on 9V!

Downside: too much controls :)
Thanks for the review!! Sounds like I will be building this one soon, just need to put order a few parts.

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Post by greenskull »

alessandro wrote:The leds mounted in the original (and in the little voodoovibe) must be transparent yellow type not dark painted yellow,so try to find it to obtain best results!I've mounted the same LDR miniature type i used in the easy vibe circuit and sounds amazing! 8)
Many thanks for sharing your layout work, I am preparing to build this. I will use the LDR's that are recommended for the "Easy Vibe", but I am still not certain what you mean by "transparent yelow type". Do you mean they are absolutely water clear until they are lit or are they clear yellow tinted colored unlit?
Also for an easy U.S. sub what can I use for 549C and 559C? 2N5089, maybe? Sorry for the dumb questions, just want to prevent headaches.

Bajaman: might be a good idea to socket the stage caps. I think I will, for the hell of it.
EDIT: Man, I must be burnt out.... didn't see bajaman's post about his cap experiments!! I know I'm a bit slow, but I'm beginning to worry. :(

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Post by KT66 »

hey alessandro

thanks for those layouts

could you please tell me the dimentions of the little voodoo vibe pcb.

i was going to make a hires version and fill in the white space.

thanks
kt

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Post by bajaman »

Hi KT66
The pin spacing on the ICs is always .1 inch - that is how I work out the correct board size
cheers
bajaman

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